How to Become a Copywriter w/ Sanjana Behera
While the copywriting world can feel intimidating, there are good people waiting to welcome you with open arms! Sanjana is one of them.
Entering the copywriting world can feel simultaneously exciting & intimidating! There are best practices to learn, loads of courses to possibly join, & Imposter Syndrome always seems to want to perch on your shoulder for the best view. Today I’m joined by my friend & fellow copywriter, Sanjana Behera! We met long long ago in the DMs of Instagram—shocking, I know.
The thing that never left me about that initial exchange with Sanjana is how thrilled she was that I responded to her message. The online business world can feel incredibly isolating—but all it takes is one message to shift the trajectory of your career & your perspective on the whole thing. Sanjana & I care deeply about welcoming new copywriters & sharing our experiences with them. So—copywriter or not—push play & get ready for a fantastic conversation!
With this podcast episode:
Discover how to break into the world of copywriting.
Identify what type of copywriting you should start with.
Learn how copywriters deal with Imposter Syndrome.
Don’t forget you can submit a question that will get answered in an upcoming podcast!
Meet: Sanjana
From pre-launch teasers to post-launch power moves, Sanjana's secret sauce is crafting a compelling narrative that transforms lazy link lurkers into "Full body yes" course sign-ups.
Links & Mentioned Resources:
Connect w/ Sanjana:
Connect w/ Brittany:
This episode of The Basic B podcast is brought to you in partnership w/ Leah Bryant Co.! Help me reach more service providers like you by following the show & leaving a rating or review on Apple & Spotify!
The unedited podcast transcript for this episode of The Basic B podcast follows
Welcome to The Basic B podcast, a show for the wannabe SEO savvy service providers among us for the coaches and consultants who dream of becoming known for their storytelling skills, not to mention the solopreneurs who straight up need to master all things social proof to increase sales. After a little reluctantly, fully committing to this online world of business, I quickly realized I needed to get people to come to me, I needed to tell them I was here and how I could support them. I dove headfirst into social proof, which led me to SEO, which led me to storytelling. And now it gives me great joy to share what I've learned with other business owners so they skip the hard stuff and ease straight into sales. This podcast gives you expert insights, actionable takeaways, and casual Convos with some of the online world's best and brightest experts and strategists. I think that's enough of an intro. So here we go. Today, we're having a super interesting open conversation with Sanjana about what it's like to get started as a copywriter. What it's like to be a copywriter. She's in India, I'm in America, we don't look the same, like things are very different. So we're gonna we're gonna get to all of it. But I thought it'd be kind of cool. Do you want to talk about like, how we met? Do you want to tell her story? Yeah, I mean, I'm so happy to be here. And like, let's just get started with the story parts though. It was way back in 2022. I guess it was made of it like a mid October ish. And I was like, researching frantically someone to like, just helped me guide me into SEO and like, ease me into it. And that's how I came into I came across your profile, and a few others. Just just laying it out there. So yeah, that's, that's how I came to know you. And I just shot a DM, I guess, are writing about like, how you got started. And like, if you had any resources for me, like as a newbie, and something like that, I knew very so kindly reply to me, like out of, I guess, like eight to nine people. I had DMS just just blindly DMS. And you were the first person to reply to me and that too, with this huge paragraph. I was like, Oh, my God, did I just find my tube online? Yes.
Sanjana Behera: 2:11
I was just even working. Okay. I was so happy when that happened. And then one thing led to another I discovered, yeah, we just covered a lot of common points, even though we're oceans apart. And yeah, it was just so nice after that. Yeah, it was so touching to me, because I wanted you to tell the story. Because I'm typically in your position where it's like, I'll reach out to somebody. All right, a DM and I shared this with you. When you were like overjoyed, really, you're like, oh, my gosh, you wrote back. This is great. You've been so helpful. But it really kind of sucks when you write to someone and they don't write back. And that has happened to me so many times. And so I really tried to make it a point to not have me do that to someone else. So it was really touching that you were just overjoyed that I wrote back to you. I'm curious on I don't think I've ever asked you. Did anybody else write back? Yeah, they did. But it was not detailed. It was just like a surface level answer. And, you know, something, I was grateful for it. Like it was something to just get the conversation going. But of course, they were like way ahead in the game. And back then I did not have an idea of like, who starting out how to scope out if someone was new, or someone who was like in the game for a long time, something like that. So like, I was like, okay, heating up just just about anybody. Okay. So I was just grateful that they could even, like, share the time with me. But of course, the like, I needed details. I needed a guide or mentors. So I kind of found that in you. I'm trying to think of how when I got started, what it was like, I think I just went down like the Google Search rabbit hole for a while. And I realized that my website copy was working because I had the massage practice. And I had the website for the massage practice. And then when I wanted to transition over into copywriting and SEO stuff, I was like, oh, okay, I'll just like switch over the messaging and change everything over to like, now I'm offering this thing and it is kind of hard to figure out who to reach out to and who will give you the time of day and even like what resources that you feel like you need because I think for me if I if I really didn't think about it, I needed or wanted systems I wanted like templates, I wanted to understand what I had been doing correctly and what I could then you know, build on, but what what was it that you were looking for? Like you mentioned, I think a little bit you didn't really know what direction you wanted to go as far as copywriting websites or emails or Yeah, definitely. When I reached out to you, I was like, I was doing everything for this one client, which was, you know, a Canadian based business. So I was doing everything for them right from like a website copy like product descriptions, and like blogs and events are like anything under the sun. I might have done it. So I got intrigued by you know, blog writing because that was the first project based class I entered I had acquired, and I pitched to them and like I started writing and it was good and everything, but I really wanted to, like know how to bring in traffic and how to do the stuff that actually gets my clients some kind of tangible results. And so, yeah, Seo was the first thing that I wanted to explore. And that's why, you know, I even bought your podcast, the private podcast series, and I got right I got started with that. But unfortunately, the payment thing did not work out for me like, yeah, something issue, like some issues with my payment gateway or something I just don't know. And yeah, I think that was even, you know, divinely led because that got me into thinking about email a bit more. And that's when I asked you about, you know, email marketing courses and stuff. And you led me to Brittany MC beam. Yeah, and that Yeah, yeah. And that's that was like a that was like my origin point like knowing Britney they are the origin point into conversion copywriting. So yeah, she's got some amazing products and then did you That's good. I need to have her come on and do this series with me as well. So I will make sure to like link the tool is also in she was a really helpful starting point for me to was going through her five figure elite program, which I'll link below in case anyone watching or listening is curious about that. How did you find Caitlin Collins? Was that knee? Or was that had you already found her on your own? Yeah, so I did find her on my own. I had, like, followed her and just binge watched her and entire, like, set of whatever she puts out, it was just a vibe. And I was still like, a bit skeptical about, you know, investing, because obviously, it was a large investment for me. Back then. And so like, I asked you about recommendations, and I remember you specifically mentioning about Caitlyn, and also copy writer underground, I guess come up with? Yeah, yeah. Right. Yeah. So yeah. And I thought that that was something I needed after I got into a course and you know, had all the knowledge because I need systemized, you know, school like lawn teaching for me. That is what I saw with Caitlin. And it was also you know, the copy side and also the business side. Now, that's what attracted me most to her. And that's how I knew her. But yeah, of course, I researched on my own bike, the trust got doubled and tripled when you recommended her to me. So yeah, that is how we connected. Yeah, I'm so glad I love Caitlin. I didn't necessarily want to go into launch copywriting. I eventually figured that out. But if I did, I would definitely get into Caitlin's program. She knows her stuff. Brittany, McBean does that. But she doesn't necessarily teach that she's, I would say she's fully like the business of copywriting. This is how you build your business. This is the system and the process and the workflow, and that's what I need it. So that's why I started there. And I mean, there's no wrong option. And I think that's the other thing, too, is like, there's no clearly laid out path of like college or university, where it's go through these prerequisites, go into this and then go into this specialized training and get a mentor and so on. So it's kind of challenging to figure that out on your own unless, like you said, unless you have somebody that you can reach out to and be like, Hi, I have questions. Can you help me that when I started out, I had impostor syndrome, it still pops up occasionally. Even though I've been doing this for a while. It's still like, do I have the qualifications to say this? Do I know what I'm doing here? And it's, it's our brains are so funny. I'll make sure that I like the episode of Sally because she talks about this stuff. And she's really helped me get over the hump with that. It doesn't really go away. It just kind of like shifts a little bit. Have you noticed that too? Yeah. Because my poster did not look the same, like, one year ago than it I mean, compared to what it looks now. It's just like a whole bunch of different issues. And I'm glad that I have this impostor with me right now. I don't want to be you know, sanded off 20 ready to go again. But yeah, it's just a journey. I think it's just a learning curve. So we have to like roll with it. What are some of your favorite projects to work on now? Oh, yeah. Copywriting so yeah, I'm going to get started with a website copywriting project with one of the, I guess, I think I should be saying this, like one of the first and somatic therapy and I guess trauma informed therapy like the whole bunch of a, like she is one of the first persons to be talking about it in India, like an Alaskan. So yeah, I'm working with her. Yeah, for a website. And yeah, I just wrapped up a project with another, another superbly amazing coach that I am like, I just fan girl whenever I see her face, because she's so brutally honest with everything. And that is what something I want to imbibe in future and yeah, that I wrapped up her launch copywriting. Like it was like, an entire series of prom promo emails. Yeah. Oh,
Brittany Herzberg: 10:51
also emails and then web copy. You really like. I love that. The also to just to note that you probably already know this, but the SEO shorts, they were the private podcast, we dissolved that. And they are now all live under the simple and smart SEO show. So if you ever do want to go back there, they're all out there. They're the short little snippets, and they've all been launched. So that's crystal is just doing that podcast now, which is really cool. So I'm excited to see like, what direction that goes in. But those are all available now just in case anybody else listening or watching is like, I want to listen to those, they're out. What are some other challenges that you've noticed that have come up, even in just the last year with you being a copywriter, I would just divide them into two buckets. Okay, like first would be purely mindset based and you know, environmental paste, like from like, where I come from and everything. And the second would be purely, you know, beginner copywriter kind of a mindset. So you know, the first bucket, like when I'm talking about my environment, I like there are two aspects. First is language. And second is pricing like I was, you know, in India, we speak a lot of, you know, formal English, and we write a lot of formal English. So it's like, what you would write in a union Union University, or you know, like a school essay or something like this. It's more of that, okay. And the conversational side of it is also cool, but it's not as conversational as in America. Yeah. So like words, like, snap it up? Or, you know, Snagit, you know, something like that sick? Why?
Sanjana Behera: 12:25
I don't know. Okay, so I had to, like, literally pull out my cameras just in dictionary and just go through all the phrasal verbs and everything. So just this to, like, equip myself with all of the wordings that people use. So yeah, language was a barrier, but I wouldn't say it stopped me because people did like my formal English writing. So they gave me an opportunity to explore it.
Brittany Herzberg: 12:50
Yeah, so that was about the language and pricing has been an issue and is a continuing issue. I guess it never dies down.
Sanjana Behera: 12:58
No matter where you are in the world. But you know, in India, living in India, and being a third world country and everything, so it's like, you know, people around me are working harder, maybe two or three times harder than I am and earning lesser less than me, and I'm making the same amount with one copyrighting project. So it creates a lot of guilt in me that I might be Yeah, like, I'm not doing it right or something. And yeah, not right by them. And also not right, per se, like, like, it has to be harder. The process has to be harder. Yeah. Right. And that is how you know, Caitlin, and also you have told me multiple times, like the experience of working with you, it does not have to be like you don't have to be an expert and everything like that. So yeah, those kind of mind. mindset shifts really, you know, helped me then. And you know, from the copywriting angle, and I think I'm still a newbie, I consider myself a newbie, because I know a lot of things but I'm yet to know a lot of things that my mentors know. So until and unless I'm at that level, I wouldn't consider myself an expert or something. Just today, Caitlin shared something in our private Facebook group about you know, her retainers how that that looks like, okay, and she had, you know, listed down everything like all the delivery, deliverables actually. Interesting to see my tiger on that one, too. Yeah, it's just something that happened even with friends. So, um, yeah, I just looked at them. And I'm like, Okay, how do we do all these things? How does she know everything? I mean, how do I know everything that she knows? And I was like, Okay, I have a lot to learn and okay, it can be a process. It can be a learning curve and everything. So yeah, the beginner mindset is, you know, both, you know, I would say it's just a boon and a bane boon in the sense that it helps me evolve but Bane in the sense that it sometimes kicks in a huge imposter when I you know, frantically texting you at the middle of the night you with long texts. And really, I don't know how to do this and listen that. Yeah. And you will, you will come up with solutions, like you always do. So. Yeah. That sides of the coin. Yeah. So I would say with even with language here, so as you were talking about that, growing up and learning to write and speak more formal English. It reminded me a lot of we learned Spanish here typically, that's like a language that a lot of Americans learned as a second language. And we were learning how to write and speak more formally. And I had friends who were actually from Mexico, actually from Spain, and they would say no, like, this is how we say it. We're we're just like hanging out with friends. So I don't think that that's not in a negative sense. Like it's not unique, but it's also you're not alone. Like it's pretty typical. And it's funny even before I hit record, I said something and I was like, you know, that's probably like challenging to learn the phrases and the the slang and the just like casual Congress.
Brittany Herzberg: 15:51
Question. So is that something that you just picked that up by talking with people? I know you said that you were looking at a dictionary sometimes. Yeah. And that does not really help because you're a dictionary even, you know, it's like from 2008 or something. So it just not has been updated. But yeah, reading copy from different people, copywriters, senior copywriters who have been in the game for a long time, and, and also like reading a lot of Caitlin's stuff, because I'm just obsessed with the way she writes. It's like, yeah, like, it was like, stellar. And
Sanjana Behera: 16:26
yeah, that's how, you know, I just note down, like, whenever I watch a Netflix series, or something like that, I would keep my note notes the app handy with me, like, I would just go back and write down something I picked up, and I would try to use it with my clients copy. And if they know if the thing that it is their voice well and good, and if not, you know, we try to work around it. But yeah, I'm just trying to improve my vocabulary everyday. I mean, even just a speech regular words, I'm like, how could I say happy in a different way. So I don't know if you've ever heard of it. But word hippo is one of my favorite. Yeah.
Brittany Herzberg: 17:02
It's really amazing for it like a thesaurus resource. Oh, the other thing you mentioned was pricing. I don't think that ever goes away. Like that's a challenging one. Even I just like, re updated, again, my pricing. And I'm finally at the point where I'm like, confidently charging at this rate, and it feels good, and I can stand behind it. But if you had asked me to charge what I'm charging now, a year ago, two years ago, and people can pick up on that, like, if you have a price and you're not fully energetically behind it, they're gonna pick up on that, and that's gonna come across as like, I'm not an expert. I don't know what I'm doing that kind of thing. So it's challenging, but it's not a challenge that that's a challenge that you go through a lot of either. But there have been challenges that you and I don't have, like that are different. So do you want to speak to that a bit like, especially with just like, you're in India, and you're writing for mostly American authors, and I'm in America and writing for mostly American authors, that hasn't been your experience? I think it would be a nice time to, to like segue into the story. And you know, when I was starting out with this Canadian business that I mentioned, it was a remote team, right? So the person who was just above me, who was handling all the teams and everything. So one day he like, we had a very, like a very meager salary. And, you know, intern, I guess what do they call their internship money or whatever, we had a very meager amount. And I never complained about it, because I was learning and of course, there was new and everything, so but I was like, I went into the process for like, three to four months. And they, they offered me a full time role. And I imagined that a full time role would include, you know, a better or a beefed up salary, in the sense that at least it should be like twice the amount that they were offering, previously. But when I brought up that issue, I was I was gaslighted, I was told that I'm still new, I did not know what I was talking about. And I should speak more like them, in order to, yeah, just to just to charge that kind of an amount. And, you know, this is just preposterous, the kind of amount that I charge. I actually quoted them, like, whatever I charged with my other clients, and they were like, they were completely shocked. And the worst part was, this was not even from the creator of the business. It was the managing person who lived in India and who was serving them. He was like, No, you aren't doing it right. And you know, you can't serve people like that you have to find a balance and everything. So that is what got me into thinking that okay, maybe I'm charging a lot and maybe I shouldn't and then Brittany, McBean came into the picture, I got into Copy Hackers, this a pricing tool or something. And I saw the kind of prices they charged for the stuff that I offer. And it was way way way low. Like what I did was like severely under charging myself, it felt so bad that a fellow person or like a fellow human being living in the same country that I do, working with the same kind of clients, they had mentality like that. So yeah, that yeah, that was first issue. And the second issue was in March of this year, I started working with a conversion copywriter again, she was I guess, two three years into her business or more I can't tell and she had hired me as a junior copywriter back then I was like, you know taking up any of any and all opportunities, I was not weighing my you know, my way my worth or anything. So I was like, Okay, let's just do everything that they say and we'll see about the prices and everything. So the prices were okay, but the workload was really high and the turnaround time was really really short like 24 hours or 48 hours and like three onboard blog, I did not know that it was it's not supposed to be done and they were doing and being conversion copywriter okay. And I was still like, Okay, fine. I need to learn. I will do
Unknown: 20:51
have that. And, of course, like with the shorter turnaround time, I was like just writing down whatever came into my mind went through I even did not know about voice of customer data research back then. So it was more like, whatever he saw the Creator post and like adapting it and to my voice and their voice and just create something out of it. And I submitted the first vlog and the first comment that the the lady that I was working with she made was that I did not know how to frame sentences in English. And she couldn't believe that it was not the final draft. She thought that this was the first time. And I was a point I was like nobody has ever commented on my English. No, this level. Yeah, no, and your English
Brittany Herzberg: 21:36
is good. And I remember having sorry to interrupt you. I remember having this conversation with Caitlin and like, because you had shared with me that this was something that you felt weak with and areas that you you felt weak about. And I'm like, not at all. I don't know how it came up in conversation with Caitlin, honestly. But we were both like, this is ridiculous. Like, no, she's so good with her English. And I even remember, like, whatever Caitlyn said, I shared with you. And I told her it was like I'm sharing this. Because that's just preposterous.
Unknown: 22:02
It was shocking. And actually, I kind of believed her then because the woman that I was working with, I believe to her then because I did not have any, I guess I did not have someone to turn to to talk about these problems. But I did. I had to open up in our group call with Caitlin that, yeah, the calls are started then. And she told me that, you know, you could do these these, like she listed on some steps like, you know, just going through the course creators, Instagram and seeing how she talks so that you can pick up words and sentences that she uses. And maybe you can use them directly or tweak them into something that you feel is befitting to their voice and everything. So, yeah, that that was one of the very important steps. But you know, when I submitted my mock pieces to her for the portfolio, that we have to whip up for approaching clients. So yeah, that's when she told me that she she, she felt so happy reading my pieces. And she was like, Okay, I speak or I write better than average American. Yeah, I guess she just something around the lines around that lines. And I was, I think I regained my confidence piece by piece after that. Yeah,
Brittany Herzberg: 23:17
the only thing that's similar that I had happened was I had a client who very much wanted like a sales page to be this long. And I'm exaggerating, but like, they definitely wanted like a super short sales page. And even then, even me, like, I'm in the world, I've written sales pages before I speak English. And yet I was like, maybe I can do it. And then I was also at the same time, I'm like, I can't do that. That's not how that works. I don't need to write a two mile long sales page. But I certainly can't make it like at Betty. So it was challenging, because I had my client who were saying, This is what I want. And I have these principles in mind in best practices where I'm like, that doesn't match up. So it wasn't the language thing. But it was the the best practices. And the this is just how it, this is the best formula that's going to succeed that definitely tapped into my imposter syndrome. And I was like, Maybe I don't know what I'm talking about. Maybe I shouldn't be a copywriter. And I think I think I also went to printing around that time because I was like, Am I losing it? Should I like, how would you do this and I can't remember if it was I reached out before the situation was resolved or not. But I think what I ended up doing is giving the client two options and I was like this is the shorter one, you can choose to use this if you want this is the longer one that's going to perform better. But the choice is yours kind of thing. So that is really challenging to be in any kind of scenario. And it happens to all of us undercharging having clients that give you like such strong pushback and make you question yourself and your entire existence. Like it happens and it's really crappy, and it's really unfortunate. I
Sanjana Behera: 25:37
just have to, like, let people know, whoever is watching is that you know, you cannot really make assumptions about people based on even their experiences, you know, skin color aside race side, everything aside, you cannot even make assumptions based on their experiences. Like let's say someone is 0.5 years into writing, but they might be so much better than what you've actually worked with. Like, you know, I've seen experienced people just like being very casual with their copy, like the process and everything just being very, like I guess, given delayed responses and everything. So yeah, that is something you won't face with a new copywriter. Yeah,
Brittany Herzberg: 26:17
no, you you answered the question that I didn't even have to ask which is like Do you have any tips or advice? I would say for me and it sounds like for you as well. Having that support system to go to is huge for me. That's been I would say that's been everything
Sanjana Behera: 26:30
Samuel I mean, I don't know what I would be without Caitlin. Like, honest to God, I don't know what I would be without her. Like she's so hands on with her. To the students, and she listens to everyone with so much heart and she offers everything she has. And I don't know where I would be without like, again repeating myself. But yeah,
Brittany Herzberg: 26:50
yeah, I mean, having a mentor, especially in this role really helps. And it speeds things along. And it gives you that confidence boost that you really need at the beginning. And I had people telling me, like, even predicting was like, I don't have the best website, I've had the same website for like two or three years, it's been working, I'm not happy with it. But like, it's, it gives the clients what they need when they come to find me. And I now understand what she's saying, because I'm like, I just updated my copy this year. And the messaging is a little bit different, but it's helping it's pulling in the right people. And also me showing up in the right places, is pulling in the right people, even as a newer copywriter, you don't have to know everything, have everything perfect. The things that really matter to clients are that you're going to be like you said, you're going to be responsive, you're going to have good communication. If you can come in before the deadline, you're gonna make everyone like ecstatic and it's just gonna be life changing for them and for you, and just not ghosting them. It's amazing how many people in the copywriting, SEO marketing world where they they get on the call with you, they're like, whatever, and they're great. And so you sign on, they take your money, and then it's like, where are you? Where are the deliverables? Like, what are what's going on, and people just don't know, they're kept so out of the loop. So that's something that I make sure to play up in my marketing and my messaging. And when I'm working with clients, I've even been known to send like a boxer where it's like, Hey, I'm still here, I've almost got your thing. But like, I haven't talked to you in a few days, but I wanted to let you know that I'm still here. I will, like I started to clarify with clients, I'm like, do you want me to check in and some people are like, No, it's okay. It's fine. Like, I'll, I'll see you when the stuff is done with some people like those touch points. So I I've started to get to the point where I'm like, okay, is this gonna be annoying? Is this a good thing? Is this something that you want and so that I can resonate with their personality a little bit better, and make it a really good experience for them? Have you noticed anything like that, that you do with your, your client experience?
Sanjana Behera: 28:35
Yeah, but like, before I get into that, I just want to like, let you know how beautiful your process is, like your love to your client, I guess, big with this entire thing. I actually love people who are pretty hands on once you get into their word, because like I hate delays, even with normal IRL stuff, I just hate delays. So can't imagine that with anyone. Okay, so like about me what I've noticed or what I do with my clients, I try to I, I resort to email only, like email communications, and I try to be on top of it. And I also let them know prior to hopping on a call with me or just working with me that these are gonna be my, like working hours. And I also mentioned that it would be nice tea so that, you know, they don't have to, like they I mean, they can account for the timezone differences. And like, you know, it's it usually works in my favor. Because like when it's night for you, it's the morning for us. So they feel like yeah, I'm just very hands on. So yeah, that works in my favor. And yeah, besides that, I always I don't know, I think I don't actually put a lot of thought into it other than I mean, what I'm going to just say like, it's like just keeping in touch with them on Instagram, because the people that I write like, I do end up writing for them, like I'm their biggest fans, like honest to god, I love to put out. Yeah, I would love to be their clients. I'm like that kind of excited about the programs and coach coatings and everything. So I love to keep in touch with them on Instagram. Still, one
Brittany Herzberg: 30:13
thing I've done a lot this year is shift away from doing as many zooms ironically, like we're sitting here on Zoom. But I've I've really tried to shift away from that, because I noticed I would go to networking calls, I would just hop on like coffee chats with people. And then on top of that I'm booking podcast interviews for my own thing or and for like being a guest somewhere else. There was one week where I had like three zoom calls every single day, Monday through Friday, and I was like, This is too much I can't do this. So what I've started to do is have more of those, like sales conversations, and I do it in air quotes because it just feels like a conversation. And people are like, at that point typically vetting just me, they know they want this type of solution. And they're just trying to figure out as we drive, and usually it's like two messages in there like Okay, so maybe in the contract, which is great, but I've started doing it more on Voxer versus zoom because I like that as you know, I like doing the voice notes. And also that way I'm able to send like links or I can type out or response. So that's something that shifted for me. And at first, even with that I was getting some pushback but I started to notice the clients who liked doing Voxer with me who liked that kind of experience. They were the ones that were very excited to work with me they were like my dream clients so I was like okay, we're gonna stick mostly with this. There are of course times where people need to be on Zoom and it's just easier to do some stuff that way but for the most part I tried to keep that just on boxer and I've had some really amazing clients come in the door. You and everyone me everyone all of us all copywriters will notice things as we do. Continue to like grow and evolve and build our businesses. And I think I'm only like a year ish, like a year and a half ish ahead of you in the process. And Brittany McBean, I realized, I think she's also just like, Baby to two and a half years ahead of the process. You know, for me, we think of these people's like, Oh, you're so much further ahead. I don't consider you a newbie copywriter, like you've proven yourself, if you will, to you to your clients, to people to the community. And as soon as I started, just like embracing, this is who I am, this is what I do. This is what I'm known for. That's what you have to almost do to have the people come to you that you want to come to you, when
Sanjana Behera: 32:16
you are in the beginner mindset, like am I doing this right? That thing keeps bugging you and that will show in your content, because you will be like, okay, maybe I don't want to tread the I guess I don't want to disturb the waters because they were they might be some senior person or someone who I might irk them or something. And that actually happens with me time to time even now. But you know, after having this is something I actually adopted for my Instagram is just like embodied learning and embodied teaching is just like whatever I've done, I can source content from there, and I can speak it. So it's just it does not have to be this huge. Three tips to do this or something like that. I mean, I don't have to prove my worth every damn time, I can just tell us and we will can be like, Okay, this is the person I want to work with. And that is true. That will happen. Yeah,
Brittany Herzberg: 33:04
I'm so excited to see you just continue to grow. Because it's been really fun watching your journey already. And seemed like kinda like blossom. One of the things that we wanted to touch on was just like, what do we love about copywriting in this work and what we get to do and who we get to work with?
Sanjana Behera: 33:18
Yeah, this is something again, I knew that is happening with me, I just registered my business or like two days prior. Yeah. And it was like a journey for me, because I've never in a million years imagined myself as an entrepreneur, there is this yearly audits, right? So I have to look for the audits, I have to keep up with the invoices, I am actually a business now I'm in charge of, even though you know, it does not exist in brick and mortar, it's still in my mind, it's very real in my mind, and in my clients mind, and and everybody who comes into contact with me. So yeah, I have to be responsible for that I am the face of my brand, all of these new thoughts about how I can present myself as just coming into the fold. And, you know, previously, I knew that I was creative, but it would lead to this, this huge, miraculous thing where I can be myself, I can write whatever I want, I can still you know, be an asset to a business or you know, a person that I mean, just a real dry deriving my words from helping people, I used to be in that category, like deriving my worth out of it, but just deriving My Word out of who I am right now. Because this because of this entire journey, and I'm like super grateful that I get to experience it. And I never again, I'll just say it again, I've never imagined that this would happen. And it's just continuing to grow in all of these beautiful ways. I even have ideas of how I want to, you know, grow locally. And you know, what imprint I want to leave on Indian market compared to like Western market and everything like all of these suits. I mean, light bulbs are just, you know, I love this aspect of, you know, being a copywriter, just having the whole platter of it.
Brittany Herzberg: 35:04
Yeah. And we could do with it, whatever we want. And for those of us who want to do good things, it's really easy. But I totally agree with you, and even just thinking of like, the legacy that we're gonna leave and what that's going to look like and how people are gonna remember us and that kind of thing. Like it, it to some degree, it sounds morbid, but it's also like, it's really impactful. And it's really empowering to think that like, oh, I have all this and I get to choose how I how I'm going to do this, how I'm going to show up what I'm going to you know what Mark, I'm going to leave. For me, I would say one of the things I love about copywriting in general and just like SEO, copywriting as well as just like I'm constantly learning, and you were talking about being your clients biggest fan girl like same. Also also never thought that I would own my own business. And here I've owned two. So it's really funny because I always thought of that as a really like volatile career opportunities. I was like I've got going there. I want steady and stable. And that's the cool thing that you get to do with your business, especially when you figure out who you want to help how you want to help them what you want to be known for. It's really amazing. So I love learning. I love the clients that I get to work with. It's been perfect because I'm usually an ideal client for them. And so it's very easy for me to slip into the client hat and also the expert hat. So like it's really fun, and I love that you get that too. Yeah, it's
Sanjana Behera: 36:21
just that is what I really believe is that how I actually I actually have seen this with you know, multiple people the way you write, the way you talk about things online. It just attracts the same kind of people. It just has been my experience like I talked a lot, I guess, in a very poetic manner because like, I have been writing poetry for a long time. And it's like all from motivational and you know, heart centers basic. Yeah, you know, I hope you do this, I hope you do that. It's like more of what I speak is not even my intentional messaging, but it's just how it comes out. And I've seen that the people that I work with also talk in the same manner. And they also talk about expanding those things. And that makes me so happy because there are people making these these very real urgent and much needed changes. And we get to be a part of that huge, you know, ripple effect.
Brittany Herzberg: 37:14
I'm really grateful that you joined this was the first time that we've actually like, met face to face. So I was really grateful that you are excited to do this. Where can people find you? Because I know that they're gonna people who are like, Oh, I'm gonna go find you. I want to go say hi. And so where can they find you? Yeah, definitely.
Sanjana Behera: 37:29
Come say hi. I met Instagram, you know, the profile is copy with Sanjana. And I only live there for now. The website will be coming up soon. So when that happens, Brittany can inform you. Yeah,
Brittany Herzberg: 37:42
I'll make sure that the links get updated below. Any final parting words?
Sanjana Behera: 37:46
Yeah, there's just one thing I have to you know, let people know who want to embark on this journey is that just believe in yourself how little it is, even if it is like you have always seen things that have worked against you, you have believed in a god or in universe in airports, because you know, yeah, and it has, you know, never panned out for you and that you think that being a creative never gets anywhere that it can't get you the life you ever like desire dreamed of. And now first of all, you can't even help people because you know, you are in the business of making money and all of that. It's just nonsense. Believe in yourself. Believe that, you know, you have a vision you are capable of, you know, manifesting it in whichever direction and whichever way you want. You can help people you can make money, you can be creative, and it's just true in all of the sentences.
Brittany Herzberg: 38:38
There's like no better way to wrap this up. I couldn't have said it better myself. Thanks for that was really something wasn't it? Let that really sink in and guide you toward being the answer to even more Google's questions. Thanks so much for joining me this episode. You are the reason this show exists and that it keeps growing. You know, thanks to all those follows and reviews. If you know someone who could benefit from what we've shared, send it to them. We don't do shy around here. If you thought of clarifying or follow up questions about listening, you know what to do. Say hi on Instagram, check the show notes for all the things that were mentioned and I'll talk to you soon friend