The 3-Step Process I’m Following to Get Found on Google

podcast

Apr 24

After 5 years in SEO, I’m taking myself through my own SEO & Grow Method!

Surprise! I find myself in the guest seat today.

Colie flipped the script & interviewed ME on my own podcast—and honestly?! It might be one of the most real conversations I've had about SEO, business growth, & doing the work I tell everyone else to do (but haven't always done myself 😬).

We're celebrating 5 years of SEO being a game-changer in my business & life.

In this episode, Colie & I get into the messy, honest, exciting truth of what it actually looks like to build a business on SEO—including the parts I'm still figuring out!

You’ll even hear a sneak peek at a new offer I'm cooking up 👀

If you've ever thought "I should really do something about my SEO"—this is your sign. The bat signal IS up 🦇 & that “play” button is waiting for you.

Topics covered in this podcast episode:

My origin story & how 2 strangers finding me on Google changed everything
Why I ignored my own data for years (yes, even as an SEO coach)
How & why my 3-Step SEO & Grow Method evolved from "just start somewhere" to a specific, proven process
The real reason your clients want to understand the WHY—not just the what
Client wins that have me forever being the world's most enthusiastic SEO hype girl
Going evergreen with SEO & Grow & what that's required me to build on the backend (with help from Colie!)
Why SEO is basically a form of self-care for your business

SEO can feel like an incredibly complex, time-consuming thing—and it can be.

…or you can let it be the most easeful, sustainable marketing strategy that delivers clients TO you.

The choice is yours.

FIND THE BASIC B ON YOUR FAVORITE PODCAST PLAYER

Meet: Colie James

Dubsado Certified Specialist, Honeybook Educator, Podcaster, Photographer, Disneyland Passholder, and your new Business BFF that tells you like it is!

Her superpower is making complicated shit super simple—particularly with regards to systems strategy & automations.

With 11+ years in the creative space, Colie believes every creative deserves to build a business that is sustainable and profitable, and no one should quit their 9 to 5 only to work 24/7 [in their business].

The truth—automated systems can save us all from being overworked and overwhelmed.

Mentioned Resources:

🔗SEO Basics Checklist (recently updated!)

🔗Keysearch (*affiliate link, use code KSDISC for 20% off)

🔗Join SEO & Grow (for a limited time, take 10% off when you use code BASICBPOD at checkout)

🔗5-Day SEO Sprint (coming soon!)

This episode of The Basic B podcast is brought to you in partnership w/ Leah Bryant Co.! Help me reach more service providers like you by following the show & leaving a rating or review on Apple & Spotify!

The unedited podcast transcript for this episode of The Basic B podcast follows

Colie James:

Hello, and welcome back to the Basic Bee podcast. In case you have not figured this out, I am not your usual host and favorite SEO coach, Brittany Herzberg, but she is joining me today as a guest on her own podcast. Now, in case we haven't met, I'm Colie James. I am your systems professor and one of Brittany's business besties. Now, a few weeks ago, I brought up the idea to her to let me interview her for her own show. And so that is why we're here today. Now, in case you haven't come over to my podcast, which is Business First Creatives, Brittany is a regular guest over there. She was on my podcast less than a month ago when we talked about transitioning from done for you offers to done with you offers. That podcast can be considered like a part one of this episode. So if you have the time and the bandwidth, please go visit the show notes. It is linked there. But otherwise, this is about to be an amazing conversation where Brittany is forced to be a guest on her own podcast. Britney, welcome to your own podcast. How are you today?

Brittany Herzberg: I'm laughing my ass off over here hysterically, which you can see, but nobody else can.

Colie James: It's okay. So every time I have Brittany on my podcast or I have been on this podcast actually three times, I think this is my fourth visit. These conversations are always amazing, insightful, and I'm not just saying that because I like to talk about myself. So today I am going to be interviewing Britney about her experience as a business owner and what it has looked like over the last five years of having SEO work for her. Now, yes, guys, this month is five years of SEO for Brittany. So let's all give her a few cheers, send her a nice little threads dm, and. And now we're going to jump into it.

Brittany Herzberg: Okay, I'm so ready.

Colie James: So, Brittany, first of all, I'm sure that the listening audience knows why you jumped into SEO, but your origin story is such an important part of being a business owner. And so I want you to reiterate that in this episode, even for people who have already listened to it, because often we don't talk about our origin story in the same way when we are interviewing somebody else on our podcast, as we would when we are actually being interviewed or, you know, for one of those solo episodes. So tell me about how you got started in SEO.

Brittany Herzberg: That is such a good point. So five years ago, which I can't even believe I'm saying that, I was living in a brand new state. I had closed my Massage practice, and I was struggling really bad. It was the main breadwinner and no bread was coming in. There was nothing. I'm laughing about it now, but I was like crying.

Colie James: It was not funny then. Very bad.

Brittany Herzberg: Not funny at all. And all of a sudden, two people ended up finding me on Google and they booked with me. And all because I had to do some digging. But I found out that because I changed a couple things on my website, which I eventually found out were SEO pieces, they were able to find me, book with me, and I was like, let me learn more about this. So I dove into that rabbit hole, mastered it pretty quickly, I think. And I also like, once I learn something, I like sharing it, I like teaching it. And so now you can't get me to shut up about it.

Colie James: But let's bring this around to data, because it's one thing for you to say, oh, this works. Two people booked me. Yeah, those two people could have been an anomaly. So once you figured out that, hey, wow, these two people found me, and I've, you know, only been here for so long, how is it that you use data in your business to track how your SEO was going in your new location?

Brittany Herzberg: So I largely ignored the data for myself and even for some of my clients too, because I was so terrified to see that what I was doing wasn't actually working. And yet I was seeing the clients come in and tell me that they found me online. I was hearing from my SEO clients that they were getting clients booking them from Google, and yet I was terrified to look at the data. So I'm slightly ashamed to admit that, but that is just like the real honest point of the matter.

Colie James: So what about your framework? Because I know that your framework was a little different five years ago than it is now.

Brittany Herzberg: Oh, yeah.

Colie James: So tell me me about how you used to consider SEO and what your framework was and tell me what it is today and kind of what brought along that change from when you first started teaching other people about SEO to now being the self proclaimed SEO queen.

Brittany Herzberg: And others have said it too.

Colie James: Yeah, I mean, it's now in your logo, so we're gonna go with that.

Brittany Herzberg: No, it's amazing. So when I first started SEO, I was like, just do it. I don't care if you're starting with blog posts, I don't care if you're starting with your website, I don't care if you're starting with social media, just do it. And I was seeing people starting and doing something, but something was missing. Something wasn't quite Clicking, they would start on their website and fall short where they wouldn't do a blog, or they would start with their blog posts and never get around to actually plugging it into their main website pages. And it dawned on me a little over a year and a half ago where I was like, it has to be, start with your main website pages, then move into content, then start looking off your website to make sure there's a cohesive message going all the way around. And that is especially key for having AI search results, having you show up there, and having people come over and click over to your website and then do something once they're over there. So really, when I distilled it down, it felt too simple, and it still feels too simple. But it was three main steps. You understand SEO and then you implement it, and then you maintain it. And I swear maintenance is like the easiest thing because it's just ongoing little action steps that you're taking every single month. So that was like the biggest shift of, like, I'll meet you where you're at with some SEO whenever you're ready, all the way to, like, no, this is what we need to be doing. This is what works. And I've seen it proven time and time again, which is really fun.

Colie James: So it's interesting to me that you said, understand SEO, implement SEO, because what happens when the clients just don't get it? I mean, you know me, systems person, sometimes. Actually, it's not sometimes, Brittany, it's most of the time. And actually, I'm looking at you like, I feel like sometimes you as my client, I tell you to go do the shit and you do it, and you don't actually understand why you're doing it, but after it's implemented and you see what happens, then you understand it. So do you have SEO clients like that? Because the funny thing is, I think maybe it's my human design. Hey, are we going to talk about human design in this episode? But it might be that. But, like, my clients just want me to tell them what it is that they need to do. I sometimes think about it as the reverse. I'm not trying to get them to understand it before they implement it. I'm like, this is what you need to do. After they do it, then either by default or by me re explaining it, demonstrating it, whatever it is, then it makes sense. So do you always follow those three, or is it just that in the end, those three are what get you where you need to go?

Brittany Herzberg: That is a really good point. I would say even hearing you Talk about that. Understanding follows you the entire way through. But we have to start with some kind of core basis of just foundations. What are keywords? Where am I going to go? Where do things exist on the back end of my website? How is this thing going to impact this thing which is going to impact this other thing? And honestly, I thought the same thing. I was like, they just need to learn how to find some keywords and where to plug them in, and that's all they need to know. But what's been cool to see, especially with the SEO and Grow program, is that they really like understanding the why. So many of them have said that to the point where I'm like, really? You've like, all this information? Okay, I'll keep, like sharing it and repeating it on calls. So, yes, understanding follows you the entire way through. Implementation follows you the entire way through. But if I'm thinking of it just with your core website pages, you are starting with that basic level of understanding, and then you're going and finding things and implementing it and then you're maintaining it. But yeah, it's both. It's a yes.

Colie James: And I'm going to shamelessly plug our last episode one more time. So if you've been listening to us for these eight minutes and you were like, yeah, I don't need to listen to this last episode, I'm a little surprised that you're puzzled about the fact that people specifically in SEO Grow want to know the why. Because that is the whole thing that we talked about in that other episode is how different are done with you clients are from our done for you clients. And so I just want to bring this up because I believe that there are some people who were done for you that will transition to done with you, but done with you people are different. They do want to understand the why. And that is specifically why they are joining SEO and Grow is because they are people who can't just set it up and forget it. They want to understand why things are happening so that if they have to make changes in the future, they are educated enough to do it. So if you haven't listened to the episode, guys, really go back and listen to it, because that is what Brittany and I dove into, like for an entire hour on my podcast. But let's talk about those clients. So the clients that are currently doing done with you, I want you to talk about what they are seeing in terms of success in their SEO, because this is part of your origin story. I mean, you have a gift for explaining really complicated shit and Distilling it down to be really bite sized to where someone can understand and implement. So what kinds of successes are you seeing from your clients inside SEO and grow?

Brittany Herzberg: It's funny because I don't know who's more excited when they have these wins because I'm like, it worked.

Colie James: It freaking worked.

Brittany Herzberg: And I think it makes them think that it's even funnier because they're like, well that where you said it was going to work. But like that joy never goes away. I'm like the forever cheerleader. I was named appropriately for this role in life. But some of the big ones recently, especially like in Q1, have been people getting big painful clients from a Google search. And they keep sending me these messages and I'm like, keep it coming, keep it coming. You're going to have even more. So one person said that she never wanted to blog. She's like, I'm not a blogger. Once we get to that part of the program, I'm just probably going to check out. I'm like, okay, just listen, just see, just try it. Just try. And she was open minded successfully. And she now has like eight or nine blog posts that are live. And she's selling digital products from her blog posts as she's traveling the world. She and her husband are like gallivanting, like living in South America, going to different countries, doing the whole Nomad experience. And it's really cool to see this actually working for her. And she's actually posting on Instagram more because it's her fun place. Now she's able to like come back to it with the like social aspect and the joy and like just sharing stuff. And now she is on a kick, you know, everything about Social Proof. She's been sharing screenshots and talking about client stories and I'm actually building a freebie resource around her story because she doesn't want to do a podcast interview. And I'm like, I've got to talk about you though. So I'm going to build the resource around her.

Colie James: I mean, could I make a suggestion?

Brittany Herzberg: Yeah.

Colie James: So I had a client and actually I literally just interviewed her. It was last week or the week before. But when I first approached her about a podcast because she finished Systems in Session at the end of last year and I was like, hey Danielle, I'll name her. You're gonna come on my podcast. And she was like. And I was like, I tell you what, how about we record it and if you want I will let you listen to it. And if you say no, I don't want you to put. That's fine. I'll just take the transcript and write your case study from there. I mean, we just recorded it. It was awesome. She didn't even ask me to listen to it. But I might give that option to your client, still have them record, because the things that they will say are different than the things that they will write. So, I mean, if they don't want to be on your podcast, that's cool. Can we still have a conversation? Can we still record it so that I can go snatch all these amazing, fabulous things that you're going to say about yourself and me, me being Britney, so that I can use them for the case study or wherever it is that you're going to share it?

Brittany Herzberg: Yeah, we are going to record. And that's the main reason why, because you bottled it up perfectly. You cannot capture that. Like, I love just asking people the questions and getting the real raw answers because you cannot. You cannot edit yourself to ever be that good. It's just like, whatever that is off the cuff, it's perfect.

Colie James: And actually I interviewed someone right before this interview for myself, and she said, I never wonder where I am in the process. The process tells me exactly where I am. And I was like, girls, as soon as I'm done for the day, that is going somewhere on my website. I feel like my clients recently have been giving me just the most amazing nuggets. And I have a client, David, I interviewed him. He basically said what systems and session was in like this one sentence. And I yelped out loud. When he said it on the podcast. I was like, that is the most amazing thing I've ever heard that needs to go on my podcast. So, I mean, listening audience, like, you should be interviewing your clients. You should be asking them about their business, but also you should be letting them talk about it because these things are gold. And you know, SEO will bring the clients to your website, but it's things like social proof that actually push them over the line, if you will, to hit purchase and or submit the contact form.

Brittany Herzberg: Yeah, so, so true. So that's one. Ellie, she's my bookkeeper. And then Jenna also had a painful client come to her from Google. I should also say Ellie has had done for you inquiries where that have come in from Google successfully. She had this one really motivated person and she's like, this is great. I'm like, yeah, this is the kind of person that you can get because in the moment you have stuff optimized and your website gets to pop up right when and where they're looking for you. So Jenna, website designer, brand designer, she actually did the glow up and created that whole logo with the crown for me with the SEO queen thing in it. And she had a painful client come through via Google. And it was so funny because I was, like, watching her go through the process, and so she's, like, texting me these updates along the way. I love it. I'm just like, okay, and what happened then? Okay. And then come back and tell me about this. So that's been major. And then even just this week, I had a podcast SEO workshop that I was presenting in another group. Someone in that group had attended the live, actual podcast SEO workshop. And she's in the chat. You have no idea how fast I screenshotted this. She's in the chat and she's like, I was in the live workshop, you know, when this was recorded, and I've already implemented this stuff, but I haven't done all of this stuff. And I just got a client for my podcast. I'm like, see? Thank you. Thank you so much. I love you. So, yeah, it's been really fun.

Colie James: It's so excellent. So you and I have been talking a lot about making sure that your offer is something that you believe in, that it feels authentic to you. What else is it that you wish that you could tell people about SEO that you haven't quite shared yet? Like, is there anything that's just on your mind that you're like, every time I go to think about this and tell them this, I just forget to say it? Now is your opportunity to do so, Britney.

Brittany Herzberg: Gosh, I wish I had been prepped for that question. The thing that's top of mind, I will say the message is hitting this week, so I'll say it while we're recording. And it came up in your email like, you mean it program? And I piped up. I went off mute because I was like, no, no, no, no. People are so scared to be their true, authentic selves, whether that's what you're saying, what you're wearing, how you're acting. But it's so much better for you, and it's better for the clients if you just rip that band aid off and you let that be in your SEO strategy, in the copy, on your website, in your hot take center, in your blog post, or whatever you're saying in your podcast episodes. Be you. You're not gonna feel like you have to hide yourself by the time you're going. And being the professional service provider, you're going to attract the clients who are so stoked to see you. Whether you're in, like, some ratty T shirt or, like, you know, some, like, really super nice blouse, it doesn't freaking matter. It just makes for a better experience all the way around.

Colie James: So I know you've been talking to your audience about this, but recently you've realized that you weren't actually putting your money where your mouth is, so to speak. You've realized that you were telling everybody else to do their SEO and you yourself were not doing it. And I want to just give you a little grace before we, like, move into the actual question, because, Brittany, you realize this is not just you, right? Like, I have to remind myself to go update my own DAM systems, my own client communication, and. And that is what I am constantly making you guys do. So it's not just you. Sometimes we need the push to do the thing that other people pay us to help them with. And so I want to bring it back around. Now you realize that your SEO was not where it should be, as someone who's running around telling everybody to do this SEO and what results you can get from it. So you are currently on, like, your own path to go through your own program, which I think is amazing. But walk me through what that looks like right now for you to actually go through your SEO and go process on your own.

Brittany Herzberg: It's been interesting because as a manifesting generator, and yes, I will bring this up with the human design aspect because I bounce. So whatever I'm feeling inspired to do that day, that week, I'm like, I've learned. I have to go with it. So one week I published a blog post that was on a topic that really supports the key phrases that I want to get found for and the people I want to help in the ways that I want to help them. Then I think it was just last weekend that I updated my SEO titles and meta descriptions across, like, my main website pages. So the ones in the navigation bar, I know, right? I was so proud. I did a little happy dance. I was like, I'm so proud because it's so much more representative of me and where I'm at now. And I'm like, you know what? If all I get right now is just get those up online for the website, cool, I can continue working on the website copy in the Google Document. So it's been a little bouncing around. It's been interestingly challenging for me because I am so good at putting other people's stuff in front of my own. And that's been my biggest problem. And 2026 is the year that I'm like, f that I matter. I'm going on the to do list. I'm not going to get erased from the to do list. I'm going to stay there and something's going to happen every week. So whether it's a bigger production, like a blog post, or getting the SEO titles and meta descriptions created, or if it's a smaller task like optimizing my name field on my Instagram profile to match now what's on my website and doing a thing every week. But it has been challenging.

Colie James: Well, I got a question. Like, I mean, I just asked you, you rattled all of those off. Are you making the list and checking them off or are you writing it after you've done it to then check it off? Like, are you doing either of those? No, listen, you are laughing, but you and I both know that there are some people that get like a dopamine hit off of literally crossing something off because.

Brittany Herzberg: Both hands up.

Colie James: Exactly. So my question to you is, are you documenting this in a list so that when you are done. Okay, I'm just making sure. She shook her head. Yes.

Brittany Herzberg: Guys, I have a folder on my desktop and it says how I'm fixing my SEO. Yeah, that is a good point. I have been hodgepodging it. I really should go through and make the bigger list of like, all the things, because then I'll be able to see it from a zoomed out lens. I've been doing it just like one thing and then like, what's the next thing? And then what's the next thing? But I really should go zooming out. Yeah, I should know better after writing emails.

Colie James: You should. Hey, you should. But let's come back around to your offers because one of the things that we discussed in that last episode on my podcast was transitioning from done for you to done with you. You and I both feel like we are in a field where our clients get more if they are part of the process, part of the actual doing. And so my question to you is, as you are actually going through your framework, your method, how is that affecting SEO and grow and the clients that you're actually working with?

Brittany Herzberg: I would say, like, I'm a pretty empathetic person, but even more so now. I have one person in there right now. She, when we had our kickoff call, she's like, I'm a procrastinator. I'm a perfectionist. I'm like, hi, I relate. And I told her I was Going to be doing the same process right alongside her. So it's been kind of funny to see that mirrored where I was like stalling and then she was stalling and I'm like, okay, we just both need to get our butts in gear. Just get this done. Last night she finished her first set of homework at midnight and sent it. And she's like, I'm like so excited now and I can't believe that I waited so long to do it. And I'm like, I get it, it's okay. Like you did the thing and now you see how easy it is and now you can just keep going.

Colie James: I mean, that makes me feel like you were on an email. Like you mean it called this week and my client, I'm not going to name her, but one of my clients was procrastinating live on the call and I was like, I'm gonna need you to just hit enter. And then she got the email and she was like, well, this just feels too wordy. And then she sent it to me in the chat and I'm like, no, that's perfect. And then she felt more motivated to go do the thing. So for a lot of people it's just, what is that first step that you are comfortable taking? We have to get you to do something because then that one step motivates you to do the next thing, to do the next thing. And that's how you get people through, done with you. Programs like they have to start the avoidance, the anxiety, the procrastination, all of that is real. But like us as the person that they're coming to for help, have to find a way to get them motivated enough to just do one thing and then like that intrinsic motivation takes over and then they'll do the next thing and the next thing and the next thing. And I'm pretty sure that you're seeing that in your own work, right, Brittany?

Brittany Herzberg: I am with these emails and getting my whole entire workflow for the program because I know that there's holes. I don't want there to be holes. And I typically have in the past done these things where it's like launch a product, launch a workshop. It's just a one time thing. I don't need to go back and tweak it and make it prettier. And now I'm like, I want SEO and grow to be the main thing that people are coming into, so I have to make it good. But also to tie back to what you were saying earlier with the understanding piece of SEO and Like, what do you do if people don't understand it? I find that with SEO, so much of the understanding is doing so getting them to see. These are the three questions that you answer. Here's how your answers actually become the search terms that you're punching in the keyword research tool. And then here's how you weave them together. It's got this like aha moment just threaded throughout where they're like, oh, okay. And then it does that intrinsic motivation just keeps on going.

Colie James: Yes. Okay, so how are systems related to this? Because you just said that you want to improve SEO and grow and that you know that you need better systems. But like, logistically, Britney, what does that look like?

Brittany Herzberg: Like, so the biggest thing is that I'm going from cart open, cart close of like launch mode for the program to where it's Evergreen where you come in, you're in there for four months and you have that time that you're in there for. So Colle is helping me to make this not be a giant shit show over here and actually have it have like check in points and these are the milestones. And here's exactly what you do. And just like what you said your client told you earlier that you're not lost in the process. The process is guiding you. That is what I want my process to look like. I want you to feel so empowered, so confident, so clear on what's coming next that you're just like bang, bang, boom, just like knocking things out left and right.

Colie James: And I mean, I will say I feel like you need a big hug because first of all, I usually work with a lot of service providers that are doing one to one offers. And so you being an email like you mean it in systems in session is so much fun because I get to think about, you know, my brain of okay, this is, this is one to one, but this is in a bigger container. And now people are going to be starting at different times. So I just want to give you a hug because it is a challenge to go from teaching everybody the same thing at the same time with the same pace for four months, to kind of thinking through what's going to happen when you've got five students or five clients that are currently working on what you would consider the month one activities. But now you've got like someone else coming in and now they're starting over and people are progressing at different times. It really does take like a lot of brain power to make sure that everybody feels taken care of. Everybody is getting a consistent experience when people are Entering this offer or this container at different parts. And so I want to say one of the things that I make all of you do is, like, map out your customer journey, which is kind of different for a group program, especially that's on Evergreen. I mean, there's a lot of different moving parts. But was there anything that changed for you when you sat down and you actually thought about what that journey would be for each of your clients? That's different than what you were doing at SE&GROW, let's say a month or two ago.

Brittany Herzberg: I would say the process and just everything, the milestones, the next steps. Like, what do you do? It's just gotten more and more clear and more and more drilled down, because I have to. Because I can't put a billion things in an email. Except I've been told by you in that welcome email, you're allowed. I was like, colby, do I cut this one down? So, yeah, it's helped me get really crystal clear on that. And even right now, like, I am trying to have grace with myself, it's not always the easiest because I want things to be perfect and pretty when they go out and not have any hiccups. Although Megan, who came into SEO and Grow, our mutual friend, she was like, kali, I think Brittany needs you. And I had already reached out to Colie because those.

Colie James: I mean, it's kind of funny, guys. When I share clients with other people, they come to me when they hire someone. And actually, this wasn't you, Brittany. I want to say this was not Megan talking about you. This is someone else talking about someone else. But they were like, coley, is it rude if I tell this person that I just hired that they need to go through systems in session because their systems are all kind of whack? And I was like, bless you, girl. Here's a link. I mean, because the thing is, we don't want our clients to feel that way. We want them to go through our programs, our offers. We want them to get the results, but we also want it to feel consistent and easy the whole way. I mean, yes, the work may be hard, but. But it shouldn't be hard to figure out how to do the work. That part should be very nicely laid out. Again, process from beginning to end, outlined by you, so that no one feels like they're confused about where they are and exactly what they're supposed to be doing at any given moment. And so I think that's one of the most important parts of, like, basically mapping out your customer journey is making sure that you're clear on what it is that they need to do now. When we sat down to think about the emails that you were going to write, I was like, okay, but like when they're submitting homework to you, Brittany, on a weekly basis, is it that they need to just turn in whatever they've done or do they need to turn it in at particular milestones? And so what was the decision that you made and why did you make that decision?

Brittany Herzberg: So there are about eight or nine milestones, key moments where it's like, you've done this thing. Show me your work. Like walk your paper up to the front of the classroom and put it on my desk because I'm promising you that my eyes are going to be on it. It will be on it, but I need you to submit it. So I had to make that clear for them when those moments were going to be. So they're bite sized tasks like sharing, access to your Google Analytics and Google Search console. It's also things like go and just play and try to find some keywords. I don't care if you come back to me with three. I don't care if they're quote unquote wrong. I just want you to go and try. So that was one thing with my procrastinator perfectionist that I was like, just go try. This is what I want you to do. Come back with like three. And she came back with 10 because she was like, oh, I got the hang of it. I'm like, I know, excellent. So it's like little moments like that and then it grows up to the bigger one where it's like, okay, you're sending me your entire SEO strategy document for all however many pages of your website, 8 to 10, typically. And then it's gonna be a minute, I'm gonna review this. And I think people maybe, I don't know until they're in the program with me, they don't understand just how much time and effort I put into each of these SEO strategies. I probably need to rate it in, but right now it's at least like my life is on the line. I'm like, this will be good. Like, we are going to have this be so good because I care about you, I care about your business, and I care about the right clients who are really, truly typing something in a search bar right now trying to find you. And they just can't because you haven't put the bat signal in your website. So I want to help you have that be a good bat signal.

Colie James: I mean, it's kind of weird to go backwards. And I'm going to explain this. When I teach people systems, I am never teaching you how to have somebody find you. Like, when it comes to marketing, SEO, social media, all of those, I am not part of that. If you have a leads problem, I can't help you. Like, I'm starting from when the person is contacting you, indicating that they are interested in your offer. And so it's so interesting to hear you taking one step back from that. Because the phrase that I use over and over again is you need to make it easy for them to say yes to you. If you have not made the payment process, the part where they know that you're the person that they want to work with and actually give you money and say, yes, I'm in. You're not doing your job. But now that I'm talking to Brittany about SEO, it's like one more step before that. It is your job to make it easy for them to find you. Whether that is SEO or, you know, some other form of marketing, which I would argue. I've been doing SEO for the entire 13 plus years that I've been a business owner and that has been my number one driver. I mean, of course, referrals, those kinds of things are great. But like, from the beginning of me creating my business, I've relied heavily on SEO. And so if you want that to be part of your marketing strategy, it is your job to make it easy for them to find you. And then from the system side, you need to make it easy for them to actually pay you. And so both of those things together are how you get booked out.

Brittany Herzberg: And that is why we love each other.

Colie James: Because that's why we love each other.

Brittany Herzberg: I mean, in part, I mean, there's so much more to it, but that I love visually, just like how that popped in my head because it's like, yeah, that happens and then that happens and then that happened. I love it.

Colie James: And then your bank account is happy,

Brittany Herzberg: and then you're happy, your bank account is happy. And really, truly, that's your systems side of things. And the SEO side of things, it's not just a benefit to the client, it's a benefit to you too. You've got the words that sound like you and your SEO strategy, the words that sound like you and your emails that you're sending out, the system that makes sense to you for your offer or offers, all of that stuff is working for you and you get to be supported and you get to actually go have a freaking Life, you don't have to live posting on Instagram 24. 7. You get to have these things working for you.

Colie James: And you know you're big on threads. Did you happen to catch. I can't remember who it was, so I apologize in advance, but someone recently said systems were a form of self care. Did you see that thread?

Brittany Herzberg: I don't know if I did, but I love that line.

Colie James: I know. Don't you love it? I mean, and I feel like if again we take that one step back towards SEO, I feel like SEO is a form of self care for not only your business, but also you. Because once you put these things into place, now SEO continues to work for you. Unlike that, you know, reel that you spent an hour creating and you put it on Instagram and 40 people saw it that day. And now no one else is ever going to see it again in life unless it goes viral. But like SEO, it's like an investment. You put the time in now and you know you're gonna see it grow, like your savings account or your, I don't know, your investment account, whatever it is, you're gonna see it come back to you, I mean, tenfold, as it gets out there, more and more. And so whatever you can do now to create SEO strategy that will help you bring in the leads and then create systems that help you get booked and take your clients through your service is how you grow a sustainable and profitable. As long as you've looked at your numbers business.

Brittany Herzberg: And if you haven't, go call Ellie. I've got people for like every part of the segment, which I love. I love that so much to bring what you were saying a little bit more to life with your SEO investment being kind of like your business investment, money ish type thing. The story that I'm going to tell you is that one of my clients checks her data weekly and I am on a mission to get her to check it monthly. Because with SEO, I don't need you looking at the keywords.

Colie James: I mean, a week is not enough.

Brittany Herzberg: It's not. So I had this example for her this week of like, it's like your retirement account. You want to just like let it chill, let it do its thing. We'll go say hi once a month.

Colie James: Yes.

Brittany Herzberg: So, yeah, thank you for saying that because I feel very valid.

Colie James: You are welcome. A retirement account was what I was actually trying to think about because, yes, you put the money in there and like, no one can handle the up and downs of the market right now. But you know, in two years Three years, five years, you're going to look at it and you're going to be like, oh, like I have actually seen a return on my investment. So please think about SEO like that. Yeah, SEO should not be something that like, you hit publish and the next day you're like, okay, how many people saw it? Yeah, no one saw it yet. Did Google even crawl it yet? I mean, go check that. But also it's not ready.

Brittany Herzberg: Do I do that though? Sometimes. But this is again one of those do as I say, not as I do things.

Colie James: So to bring this conversation around, Brittany, like, where are you hoping to go with SEO and Grow going forward? I mean, you're working on better systems, you're going through it yourself to improve your processes. But like, what else do you have lined up for SEO and Grow?

Brittany Herzberg: I don't think I've told you this yet. Okay, so I get, I get your genuine raw reaction. I was inspired by your Sprint idea and I think you said you're rolling that into the systems in session, so it's not going to be. If you're listening, I'm sorry, you can't do this.

Colie James: You missed out.

Brittany Herzberg: My bad. But I had this idea of like, I have some people who come in my world since I'm retiring the done for you service. I want to be able to help the people who are like, but I want something now. So I'm thinking of doing a five day sprint next month actually. And so I should talk about it even more. But I want to try it and see if I can do like an express version of the program where I can offer that to people and have that more readily available. You can blow through it. Because I know that there are people who are like, just get me in and out.

Colie James: Yeah.

Brittany Herzberg: So I'm excited to give that a try. But the program, you'll be in there for four months. You have me. There is a kind of like continuation type thing. It's called the maintain membership. And I purposefully have that exclusively for anyone who's done done for you SEO with me, or who's gone through the SEO and Grow program. Because I want you to understand that process and have that foundation so that when you come in there, we're working on blogs, we're looking at your metrics, we're fixing any issues that are part of SEO on your website. And then we're also taking that to any kind of guesting stuff or social media profiles.

Colie James: Okay. So first of all, I love the Sprints and I'm gonna bring up why I feel like right now it is really true that everybody needs an extra layer of accountability right now. And so the fact that you would be on them for five days to present what I would see as like a daily task for them to do to get them towards where they need to be to go forward and do more SEO, I think that sounds amazing. And the thing about my offers is that email like youe mean, it was originally a DIY course and then I added an audit feature where you could, you know, take the course, do your emails, submit them to me. I would give you detailed feedback on every single email. And then I found people were still not doing the thing. If you did the thing, you got amazing results. But I don't know why people were not doing the thing. So then I was like, well, hey, if you come and you do this in a week with me, you get me, you get the live feedback and you get an actual call to put on your calendar every single day for that week. And that really worked in February. I mean, this time it's been a little different, I feel, because more people were in systems in session than were just doing the email. Like, you mean at Sprint. And so I do feel like, not that there was an imbalance, but like, I don't think that there was the same urgency. Now you did your emails like a good little student, the A plus student, but you, but you, you did a lot. And so, I mean, you got your whole customer journey mapped. And so a lot of people saw it as, oh, well, this was just a bonus. It's okay if I don't get it done in like the Sprint time because I have more time before I actually start. And you and I will have a conversation about this. But I feel like if you identified what the tasks are that people need help with but can also do in a short amount of time and you basically check them off and then they're ready for the more long term strategies. I mean, I could really see this working well for you. So I'm excited to hear that you're gonna try out a Sprint. I don't know. I feel like right now anybody who has a Sprint, I would be willing to pay them money to do it. I feel like I personally need to block off that time on my calendar. And so that is what I'm giving my clients.

Brittany Herzberg: I love it. And I wasn't even prepared for the email like, you made it Sprint, but I was like, we got it, it was on the calendar. And I was like, I will make sure that I try to at least show up when I can, and when I can't, I'm watching the replays and I'll try to take even a tiny action step.

Colie James: Well, and I should tell you, one of my clients, I mean, I'm still not done going through her emails. She sent me her Airtable hub. Do you know how many touch points were in there, Brittany? I just want you to guess with that. Facial Express 2086.

Brittany Herzberg: Oh, God.

Colie James: And I mean, listen, it was a combination of actual emails, and then some of them were text messages. And then, remember, every time we're sending somebody asking them to do something, we're sending reminders. It doesn't mean that you're going to send all those reminders to your clients. So, I mean, if people do things in a timely manner, I think at least 25% of those emails, if not more, would be completely eliminated. But you write the emails so that you have them. If you have clients that are procrastinators and don't do what you tell them to do when you tell them to do it. So that's like the range, Brittany. I mean, do you get what I'm. I mean, some people have shorter customer journeys. And I mean, this was a wedding photographer, so longer Runway often being booked one year in advance. They're going to have more education emails. But the process is the process. And all I'm really trying to get you to do is think about your clients and when they need those particular touch points. And so I'm really happy that you are doing that for your SEO and Grow clients, because, I mean, they may not know that you've taken the time to go through and, like, plan these things, but they will certainly feel the results once they've gone through the program.

Brittany Herzberg: Yeah, I agree, and I'm so grateful because it did actually give me just a chance. Even if it was like 15 minutes in a day. I was doing something for my business that made me feel good, that, like, future Britney will be very grateful for.

Colie James: And I'm so happy that you're taking that and you're going to make your SEO and grow. I'm so excited. I can't wait to see how this plays out.

Brittany Herzberg: I'm thrilled. And then you're going to get to experience it, and then we'll be able to have you back on the podcast where you talk about that.

Colie James: So, yeah, and I will say, me going through SEO and grow is so timely because, as you know, I did a shift. I feel like in 2026, I came in with two offers email like, you mean it? And systems in session. And now I've kind of put those two together. And so now I'm selling one thing all the time. And I don't know if you've been to my website lately, Brittany, but I redid my entire homepage.

Brittany Herzberg: Oh, I didn't pay that close attention.

Colie James: Well, it did not reflect what I was currently doing. So, I mean, I put way more words on there. I took off all of the things that I was no longer selling. And so it probably isn't optimized for SEO yet. You know me, the minute that I do the thing, I have to hit publish. I don't care if it's perfect. Like, just get it out there. And so, yeah, I mean, I do feel like I needed to go through my website anyways because I have so many things that I am no longer offering to people. I need to make sure that my SEO reflects what I want people to find me for in this stage of my business, not what my business was a year ago, 18 months ago, three years ago. I need it to reflect what it is now. So, I mean, I do really need to start from scratch in a way to make sure that the keywords that I'm using, the page titles, my H1, H2, H3, all of the things are optimized to bring people to my world specifically for systems and session. What it is the results that you get and make sure that the things that I was optimized for, like, let's say, Dubsado workflow templates that I no longer sell, I want to make sure that I have recrafted that in a way because technically I'm still helping you with your workflows and systems in session, but it's different. And so I need to make sure that my copy, and more specifically related to you, my SEO is enables people to find me for the things that they are searching for and know if systems in session is the result that they are looking for.

Brittany Herzberg: Exactly. Making it an easy yes for them.

Colie James: Yes. Okay, so I cheated at the beginning. I mean, Brittany was going to give you guys her intro and I was like, girl, shut up. You cannot do the intro for a podcast where you are the guest. But I am going to let you close this off because I feel like me telling everybody, you need SEO and grow and just go buy it. I mean, that sounds a little weird and you can do it way more eloquently than me. So I am going to let you close this episode out. I want to say thank you so much for letting me come on and interview you, but now I'm handing the mic back over to you. Oh, my gosh.

Brittany Herzberg: Thank you. I do want you to tell people, though, give them your website, tell them the podcast name, tell them where they can find all the things, because I'm sure now they're like, well, I've got people coming to my website now I need the systems.

Colie James: Now I need the systems. Well, everyone, my website is coleyjanes.com. my podcast is Business First Creatives. And like I, I said, the episode that Britney and I did not even a month ago is linked in the show notes. But I would love to have you as a listener. And Britney is a frequent flyer in terms of guests. I mean, I'm pretty sure that was episode five for her. I mean, we keep saying we're gonna go on each other's podcast every other quarter, so we're trying to keep that up.

Brittany Herzberg: We're doing better now. We had a wide gap there for a minute, but now we're back. So, yes, if you have heard this and you're interested in making it easy for people to find you, allowing yourself to go have that life that you want to live, have a business that actually supports you, that's bringing in aligned leads, SEO and Grow is here for you. You can check below. I will either have, I'll probably have both links, one for the evergreen program option and I need to go build that page and I'll get that up as soon as possible for the five day sprint. Thank you so much for joining us. Thank you, Colie, for interviewing me. This is so fun. I'm so glad that you had this brilliant idea. And for you listening, just remember, I'm over here cheering you on on your SEO journey.

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