Pre-Launches, Storytelling, & Case Studies w/ Brenna McGowan
Sell more with stories. Get more stories by doing market research. And get both to market for you with a pre-launch strategy!
How could a pre-launch change the way you feel about launching? Pre-launch marketing is a growing trend—but it’s been in my line of sight for years thanks to Brenna McGowan. Brenna is not only a friend & mentor, she was my very first DFY case study client! In this interview, we get into what you can pre-launch (hint: more than just courses), how case studies support pre-launches, & how often you should ideally be doing market research. If you’re resistant to launching or wanting to make launches feel enjoyable—don’t miss this conversation!
Topics covered in this podcast episode:
What a pre-launch is and when to use this strategy
What you can pre-launch (hint: not just courses)
Taylor Swift as a pre-launch example
What you don’t find in a pre-launch: constant selling
How Brenna helps business owners with pre-launches
How case studies and pre-launch marketing work together
How often to gather market research (aka: VOC)
How to weave in the P.A.C.E. framework into your pre-launch
Don’t forget you can submit a question that will get answered in an upcoming podcast!
Brenna McGowan is a launch strategist, copywriter, and creator of Anticipation Marketing™. She helps coaches, course creators, and high-end service providers increase launch revenue, call in perfect-fit clients, and reduce launch burnout with a strategic pre-launch.
Mentioned Resources:
Connect w/ Brenna:
Connect w/ Brittany:
This episode of The Basic B podcast is brought to you in partnership w/ Leah Bryant Co.! Help me reach more service providers like you by following the show & leaving a rating or review on Apple & Spotify!
The unedited podcast transcript for this episode of The Basic B podcast follows
Welcome back to the Basic Bee Podcast. I am stoked to have you here and I'm back with another guest and a dear friend. We have so much stuff to talk about today. We're going to be diving into all things pre-launch. I'm here with my friend, Brenna McGowan, let me give you a quick intro of Brenna and then we're going to get into all the questions. Brenna McGowan is a launch strategist, copywriter and creator of Anticipation Marketing.
She helps coaches, course creators, and high-end service providers increase launch revenue, call in perfect-fit clients, and reduce launch burnout with a strategic pre-launch plan. Brenna also happens to have been my very first done-for-you case study client. She's even come back for more, which is super flattering, of course. And I've gone through her PPP program. So all of these topics, PPP, pre-launch, case studies, are going to come up today, so I want you to have that backstory. But.
Brittany Herzberg (00:45.298)
Brenna, welcome, thanks for joining me.
Brenna (00:47.456)
Thank you, I'm so excited to be here.
Brittany Herzberg (00:56.694)
Brenna, welcome! Thanks for joining me.
Yeah, it's nice to have you. All right, I'm gonna hit you with the big question that I ask all my guests and then we'll get into the rest of the stuff that's actually pertaining to the topic. Are you ready?
Brenna (01:04.704)
big question. And then I ask all my guests and then we'll get into the rest of the stuff that's actually pertaining to the topic. Are you ready? Yes. Which do you believe is most important for sales? SEO, storytelling, or social media? I know I was like, this is such a trick question because they're all so important, right? So I put a little thought into this. And I'm going to say storytelling. And that is because storytelling, there's actual studies.
Brittany Herzberg (01:12.098)
Okay, which do you believe is most important for sales? SEO, storytelling, or social proof?
Brittany Herzberg (01:24.033)
Yeah.
Brenna (01:34.224)
I should have looked them up, but I didn't. We're like storytelling, it gets into our subconscious, it's the way it's helping stay with us and they kind of, they seep into our being, if you will. So I'm gonna say that storytelling is the most important and whether you're telling good stories and you can of course bring in case studies as part of a story, so that's the other reason why. I was like social.
Brittany Herzberg (01:35.726)
..
Brenna (02:00.608)
proof or storytelling, right? But I do think it's storytelling. When you can tell a good story, you can also tell a really great case study, testimonial story. And even with your SEO, like your SEO is only gonna be as good as if people coming and actually reading your content. So I'm gonna say storytelling.
Brittany Herzberg (02:05.324)
Mm-hmm.
Brittany Herzberg (02:17.729)
Yeah.
I love it and you know what's gonna, you're gonna laugh. The thing that's coming to mind is when you had, was it a mouse in your drain and you talked about it in your email? Oh my gosh. Mm-hmm.
Brenna (02:23.712)
The thing that's coming to mind is that you have a little event coming up in your dreams. Yes. And you talked about it in your email. Exactly, and you remember that story, right? So anytime, so I stay top of mind without even trying to because now the story, so I think now we have to tell people the story, right? Like, yeah. Tell us about the story. So I actually use this story inside of, I do an event called Behind the Launch and it's one of my reminder emails.
Brittany Herzberg (02:39.584)
You
Yeah, no, you need to. Yeah, tell us about the mouse.
Brenna (02:53.588)
And the thought process behind the story was people are very busy and things come up unexpected. And I want them to upgrade to a $27 ticket and so they can listen to all of the interviews. So what happened on this particular Sunday as I went into my bathroom, it was just, it was a regular old Sunday, I walked into my bathroom and I turned my shower on, right? And I had the kind where you
it's like a big knob, if you will, and you kind of you don't you turn it over. So I turn the shower on. And I forgot to do something. And I was like, Oh, shoot, I need to do that before I take a shower. So then I start putting the lever back the other way to stop the water flow. And as I do this, I look down. And I'm not joking, a mouse crawls a wet mouse crawls from the drain.
you know from the bottom drain and comes out and into my bathtub and I just scream so loud my thank God my husband is a firefighter so he's gone 48 72 hours at a time like thank God it just happened to be a Sunday that he was home when this mouse came through the drain and can you imagine like I was like what happens if I didn't forget to do something I would have turned the water on like right and jumped
my naked body into the shower, I would have had a mouse crawl. I can't even fathom what it would have been like. But yeah, this is why storytelling is so important. And this is why I love what we do as business owners, especially in the online world, is where this random story of how a mouse crawled through my drain becomes a sales mechanism, if you will.
Brittany Herzberg (04:25.725)
No.
Brittany Herzberg (04:45.522)
Yeah, it really does. Oh my gosh, I love that so much. And PS, like subtle, not so subtle plug for your email list. If you are not on Brenna's email list, she writes some of the most entertaining and impactful emails I've ever read. So please go get on her email list. And of course, we'll have the link and everything in the show notes and we'll talk about it later. But let's get into pre-launch because I definitely don't want to miss out on the main topic. So can you just, let's start with the basics. What exactly is a pre-launch?
Brenna (04:55.776)
I'm not sure if you're not, but as you know, she writes me the most interesting and impactful email I've ever read, so please look at her email as her first public information. And I'm sure I'm not gonna talk about it later, but let's get into pre-launch, because I definitely don't want to miss out on any comments. So can you just start with the basic? What exactly is a pre-launch? Right, so a pre-launch is, it's simply a time period before your actual sales promotion. So,
I help a lot of course creators and online businesses with like, you know, sell their programs So this would be the four to eight weeks depending on what we're what the strategy is before People can officially come to buy But you can use a pre-launch in so many different aspects, right? Like you can pre-launch an event that you have coming you can pre-launch a that your website is about to get released Like there's so many other ways that pre-launch can be used
So, but essentially at the core of it, it's just a time period right before the thing actually happened.
Brittany Herzberg (06:01.13)
Yeah, and you have painted this picture before where you were talking about a new movie will be coming out and we hear about it eons before the movie is actually out. Do you want to speak to that a little bit more? Because I know the way you describe it is just like really perfect.
Brenna (06:07.356)
and you hear about it, Eon, before the media actually, I'll give you that, speak to that a little bit more, because I know the way you describe it, it's just like, really personal. Yeah, exactly. So, you know, whether, pre-launch is used in the entertainment and retail industry all of the time. It's funny enough, I actually had someone send me a picture this morning. I have a friend who's traveling to a different country, and she noticed that there was,
this display for Mother's Day and she thought it was for Mother's Day like America's in May and for them it was in March but what it is like it's that time period where you think about I always say that Costco is a great example when you go into Costco in September there's Christmas trees up there well that's because they're not really expecting you to necessarily go buy a Christmas tree at that point it's because they are teasing what is to come.
Brittany Herzberg (06:41.677)
Heh.
Brenna (07:03.412)
The entertainment industry is a great example too. You don't find out a new record is coming out. Look at Taylor Swift. She's my favorite example. And not even because I'm a Swiftie or anything. It's just because she's talking about right now how she's recording a new album. You're not finding out about that new album the day it's released. She's teasing this all the way and building up anticipation. Same thing with a movie, a movie that's coming out. The trailers start 120 days before a movie actually comes.
And so there's a reason for that. There's a reason why the entertainment and retail industry is doing this. And it's because they're seeding in, they're getting the, you know, they're trying to get the little room in your brain that we have left for what are we gonna buy? What's coming up? And when we can do this with our online courses, our programs, our services, we have a true advantage over our competitors.
Brittany Herzberg (07:55.118)
For sure. I love that you point that out. And yeah, Taylor Swift does a good job. I think Beyonce like ended up doing that with her current album that's out, right? Where she was like teasing it forever in advance. She's another one that just like teases stuff in advance, which is great. So teasing and anticipation. I know you talk about anticipation marketing. Can you really what I want to know is have you seen people do anticipation marketing wrong? And can you tell us a little bit more about what that is in your world?
Brenna (08:08.541)
So using an anticipation, I know you talked about anticipation marketing. Can you, really what I want to know is have you seen people do anticipation marketing wrong? Can you tell us a little bit more about what that is in your world? Yes, I would say...
No, and yes, right? Like what I see done wrong during like what I consider this anticipation marketing period or pre-launch period, the biggest mistakes I see is that people ignore their audience, they're so focused on the event that they forget to do the anticipation, the preceding, the teasing, the belief shifting, all the things that happen in a pre-launch, they just kind of throw that by the wayside because they're so focused on.
whatever that thing is that they're selling. So that is where I see things go wrong. The other thing that I see wrong is that people are putting out random content. So sometimes people will be like, oh, that seems like more work, right? Like we're not selling during pre-launch. It's a way of being very, very intentional about the content that people are seeing before they get a whole bunch of promotional emails or start seeing a promotion. The thing about it is,
is that hopefully you're not one of those people that's ignoring your audience, you're putting content out there. But a lot of times they're just putting, we're just putting out random content. We're just throwing stuff out there and not really thinking about what do I need to say and do before my promotion that gets people interested, that gets people leaning in, that gets people excited, it gets people in the mindset that they want to buy from us.
Brittany Herzberg (09:43.986)
Yeah, I love that you mentioned that. And having gone through PPP, you definitely, it's not six weeks of selling, like you said, so I don't want anyone to miss that. It is very much like you're still just putting out content, but it's strategic content because you're building up to, you know, oh, hey, here's this program that I have. And by the way, like over the last six weeks, we've been talking about this stuff and now your beliefs have been shifted.
you've kind of moved through the journey without even realizing it, but not in a sneaky way, just like in a very strategic way.
Brenna (10:10.628)
you kind of knew what to do to bring it without even realizing it, but not in a creepy way, but in a very creepy way. Exactly, and that's it. For anyone who's not familiar, PPP stands for the Pre-Launch Plan Program, which is my group coaching program where I show you the proven systemized process that I show people exactly what to do to do everything that we've just been talking about. Yeah, the key is you have to be able to pre-launch those pre-launches so you then have the program and you walk people through the exact steps. And I guess I'll just...
Brittany Herzberg (10:20.447)
Yeah.
Brittany Herzberg (10:31.058)
Yeah, so you've not only created these pre launches for your clients, but you then have this program where you walk people through the exact steps. And I guess I'll tee this up a little bit because when I had this idea to do the case study copywriting done for you, case study copywriting, I was like, ah, you and I were talking a lot. I knew a lot about like the pre launch plan that you had done, the training that you were talking about. And I was like, Brennan would be perfect for this. So I reached out to you and I ended up writing case studies.
Brenna (10:39.42)
this up a little bit because when I had this idea to do the case study copywriting, done for you case study copywriting, I was like, aww, you and I were talking a lot, I knew a lot about like the prelaunch plan that you had done, the training that you were talking about, and I was like, you're going to be perfect for this. So I reached out to you and I ended up writing case studies about prelaunches, this is going to get so meta this part of the episode.
Brittany Herzberg (10:59.726)
about pre-launches, this is gonna get so meta this part of the episode. But I got to see what was going on with your clients, with your students, and I could see the magic of pre-launches actually working. Fast forward a little bit, and I have my training program, and I was like, my launches are just a cluster over here. I need to be much more strategic, much more thoughtful. Brennan's got this pre-launch plan program, why don't I get in here and learn what it's all about? Because I know that it already works.
Brenna (11:05.376)
But I got to see what was going on with your clients, with your students, and I could see the magic of prelaunches actually working. Fast forward a little bit, and I have my training program, and I was like, my launches are just a cluster over here. I need to be much more strategic, much more thoughtful. Brenna's got this prelaunch plan program. Why don't I get in here and learn what it's all about, because I know that it already works. So I wrote the case studies, I got through the PPC program, and it's just really cool to see how you've taken what you did
Brittany Herzberg (11:27.39)
So I wrote the case studies, I've gone through the PPP program, and it's just really cool to see how you've taken what you did for clients, I don't know if you still do that for clients, but how you've taken what you did for clients and translated that into a program where you very seamlessly walk the rest of us through, here's how you do this for yourself. And it feels very approachable and it feels very methodical and very easy to do.
Brenna (11:35.33)
I don't want to show you that at the time, but how you should do it with the client and change it about into a program where you very soon, if you walk the rest of the room, here's how you do this for yourself. And it feels very approachable and it feels very methodical and very easy to do. Yeah, and that's the biggest compliment that I get about, I was just doing a case study interview with someone who went through the program the last time, and that was something that really struck me. It was just like, okay, this is simple and organized and doable. And shout out to Nissa Brown.
who was my curriculum specialist who actually helped me take what I did for clients and put it into really good curriculum that can be consumed and so I can't I can't Talk about the program and in that respect and not mention her because it made a huge difference
Brittany Herzberg (12:23.966)
Yeah, for sure. I'm glad you gave her a shout out. I'll try to make sure I grab a link for you so we can introduce people to her. But that's a good segue because you're talking about doing case study interview. In the program, you definitely get us to start with VOC, voice of customer market research. It's just where you're going and talking with your clients or students for anyone listening if you haven't heard of these terms before. And I remember I went through and you and I got on a call. I went through and I interviewed a crap ton of people.
Brenna (12:29.596)
Perfect.
Brenna (12:46.384)
And I remember I went through, and even I got on a call, I went through an interview with top 10 people doing market research and doing my favorite things too because I wanna know what's going well, what's maybe doing better, what's really resonating, how do I get more people looking at my world? So I want to know how often do you think people should be gathering to post a customer for doing market research? Do you have a range of how often people should be doing that?
Brittany Herzberg (12:51.306)
doing market research is one of my favorite things to do because I wanna know what's going well, what could I be doing better, what's really resonating, how do I get more people like you in my world? So I want to know how often do you think people should be gathering the voice of customer language or doing market research? Do you have a range of how often people should be doing that?
Brenna (13:16.838)
my first answer is constantly. I don't think we realize how much opportunity we have to do market research. And so it doesn't have to be overly formal. For example, I was speaking to someone on Voxer the other day and we were talking back and forth about the program and I was just like, hey, you know, I feel like you'd be a really great fit for this and I'm not telling you this because like.
Brittany Herzberg (13:19.15)
I'm going to go to bed.
Brenna (13:39.028)
If you don't want to join the program, it's totally fine. But can I ask you, what has stopped you from joining the program if it interests you, right? And going back and asking just really specific questions. Anytime that you are putting content out there, people are commenting, engaging, sending DMs. Sometimes it's just going like, huh, can I ask you a quick follow-up question on this on something you said? Because I'm curious to hear what you think.
So I think there's an opportunity to be doing market research all the time. Like I have a Facebook group and anytime someone comes into my group, I ask specific questions. So I have thousands of answers at this point, or I think I do, I had to go back and look at the spreadsheet, well over a thousand, where I am asking specific questions around launching and what's holding people back and what do they want from the launch. But I'm gonna say, if you have not, especially in the environment that we are in,
Brittany Herzberg (14:18.614)
Hehehe
Brenna (14:31.416)
going to say every six months, like if you have not done full blown research market in a year, absolutely it needs to be done. Interestingly enough for Behind the Launch, which I mentioned was my interview series that I do, I was talking to guest experts and I did these live interviews as well in my Facebook group. And this was a recurring topic that came up, which is how important doing market research is.
to the success of your promotions. And that when sometimes we think, oh, it hasn't been that long, but Sophia Parham, almost positive was the person who talked about this, was she talked about how we evolve as humans, but we forget that our audience can evolve, right? And so I think that it's just a matter of not making it overwhelming, taking an opportunity to ask people questions. So if you have done a promotion and people haven't bought,
figuring sending out surveys is a great way. Sending out a survey to ULIS, I just sent out a survey, the pre-launch survey that I recommend, where I'm trying to get into the minds of people who are interested in, maybe interested in the program, things that they need to know or have to be in the program for them to be interested. Like there's so many different opportunities for it. So I'm gonna say it's somewhere in between six months, a year and constantly for your market research.
Brittany Herzberg (15:54.85)
There's um, that I totally agree with you because I'm always thinking, I'm even going back into like when I was just a massage therapist and I only had the massage practice because I was always asking questions or at least just like had my listening ears turned on. Because if you're listening, people are always giving you stuff that you can use in your marketing and your messaging to better understand where they're at, where they want to go, what's working well, what you can improve on. So I definitely agree with you. I want, I wish there was something like...
Brenna (16:03.3)
because I was always asking questions, or at least just like, had my listening ears turned on. Because if you're listening, people aren't always giving you stuff that you can use in your marketing and messaging to better understand where they're at, where they wanna go with working well, what you can improve on. So I definitely agree with you. I wish there was something like ABC, where it's like always be listening, always be, but anyway, it's not fair.
Brittany Herzberg (16:22.394)
ABC where it's like always be listening, always be, but anyway, it's not there. So do you feel like people need to be doing another round of market research like with each launch and or pre-launch that they're doing?
Brenna (16:28.864)
So do you feel like people need to be doing another round of market research, like what you're launching, what you're launching, what you're doing? I think it depends on how much you're launching. I would say definitely, like I said, I go back to a year if you have the capacity to get on calls. I think if also, if you're doing it a little bit more all of the time, it doesn't have to be, you know, quite every six months, but there is something about
Brittany Herzberg (16:40.021)
Mm-hmm.
Brenna (16:58.064)
really being intentional. And I think that's really what everything that I talk about, whether it's pre launch and strategy, it's like the intentionality is a little bit different when you are, you know, taking the time to either have a back and forth box or chat or asking people specifically, as you kind of get in the mind frame of your next launch, and it will help you. And the cool thing I love about the program is that, you know, with all of the assets that you get in the program, the resources,
you therefore it changes the way how you think about it. You know what questions to ask. So it will allow you, you know, when you have a system, if you will, of how to do market research, you can do it in a way that doesn't feel overwhelming, but can be very, very intentional.
Brittany Herzberg (17:42.075)
Yeah, I totally agree with you. And you do pack a lot into the Pre-Lunch Plan program. You pack a ton in there and it's really helpful. And there's every time I look in there, there's something else that I was like, oh, I didn't realize this was here. Oh, this tool is over here. It's really very well done, very well thought out. Of course, like I'm not shocked, it's you. But I am curious, you talk about case studies inside the training and I know you have your own case studies, but like...
What have you seen case studies do, whether it's for yourself with a pre-launch or for your students or clients with a pre-launch?
Brenna (18:15.728)
Oh, I think case studies, especially in 2024, like it's always been important for social proof, but people are, I say it all the time, is people are more hesitant than ever. There's been such a flood of things on the market, things that have worked that haven't worked, that people need to see social proof. And with case studies, is those stories, like what, and it goes beyond like a testimonial, right? Because when you have a case study,
you're able to tap into different segments of your market very naturally, right? Because I know I do case studies and sometimes, and it's a great way to, you know, discuss objections that people might be having, myths that someone believes, like I did a case study this last or the round before the last where I had someone who talked about how she thought a pre-launch, anyone who was, you know,
she didn't need to do a pre-launch because anyone who was going to buy anyway was going to buy during the launch, right? That was like a belief that she had. So all of a sudden, instead of me trying to like change or shift a belief in my audience, someone else is doing it for me. And there's something very, very powerful in that. I was in right after my last launch, which was my biggest launch ever. I was in, I believe,
I think I was in Nashville and it was funny, I was walking with my friend Tracy Matthews and Laura Belgray, my friends I should say. And Tracy had asked me, like, why did I think the success of this last launch, you know, what was the reason behind it? And Laura had talked about, like, she was like, oh, it was because Brenna had so much social proof. And it is because I intertwined case studies everywhere I could in different...
ways and formats, videos, snippets, like I did it all. And so I've seen the tremendous, like people wanna know, does this actually work? And because of all of the social proof, I'm able to show them, right? All of a sudden it takes away that, people are worried about being salesy and icky, and it's just like, no, like what, make a really great case in your strategy.
Brenna (20:28.58)
of why someone should buy from you and then back it up with your social proof. That's essentially what I show people at a very, you know, a very molecular, I try to use a big word there, at a very basic level.
Brittany Herzberg (20:39.51)
Hahahaha
that that's how my week is gone. It's like, let me sound smart. Wait, no, it's not working for me. No, it is though. We're just kind of like, it's Friday. We're not doing them. No, but I mean, that is so true with just seeding and social proof every single place that you can think of. And I know one thing that you talk about, tell me if I'm misquoting you, but I feel like you talk about having some kind of social proof in every email that we're pumping out during pre-launch and just making sure that it's there. And people are like so very aware that like
Brenna (20:45.312)
So don't use them as heart rate dogs that were just very... Yeah. Let's not use big words.
Brittany Herzberg (21:12.73)
Yes, I can trust this person. Yes, they have some authority. Yes, they get where I'm at.
Brenna (21:18.409)
Yeah, so I don't think you have to do it every single one, but I say that we're always looking for opportunity that we can interject the social proof into. And a lot of time when I look at emails, there's missed opportunity for social proof or
Brittany Herzberg (21:33.388)
Mm-hmm.
Brenna (21:34.768)
or for even just doing client stories. So I don't think it has to be every single time, but it's never gonna hurt, especially when you can do it in a way that doesn't feel, it doesn't feel contrived, right? Because I can tell a story about something and then go, oh yeah, and this actually happened to my client, Brittany too, and when Brittany did this, this happened. So it doesn't have to be very, it doesn't have to feel forced.
Brittany Herzberg (22:01.726)
Right, yeah, definitely. I couldn't agree with that more. And you're talking about, I love that the words that are coming up a lot are intentionality, being strategic, things feeling natural, not feeling forced and salesy. I just said that this morning on a summit interview where I was talking about case studies for health and wellness providers, because that is a group I belonged to, still belong to, and that is a group of people where they're so sensitive to not being salesy. We just want to help. That's what we say. That's what a lot of coaches will say. I just want to help people.
And the best way to show your work is to show your work and use a case study to show your work because then as a reader, I'm able to connect with you, the guide. I'm also able to see myself in the shoes of your student or your client. And it's just a very natural fit for me to watch myself going through your program or whatever it might be. I love this. Okay, you have your pace method, which I want to talk about if you're open to sharing what.
Brenna (22:32.324)
And the best way to show your work is to show your work. And you would be able to show your work because then as a leader, I'm able to connect with you, the guy, I'm also able to see myself in the shoes of your student or your client. And it's just a very natural fit for me to watch myself going through your program or whatever it might be. Exactly. As a student.
Brittany Herzberg (22:59.794)
what your pace method is. Okay, tell us about it.
Brenna (22:59.951)
Yeah. So and it's funny because you brought up I almost talked about it when you brought up social proof because the C in PACE is credibility. So PACE is personality, authority, credibility, and empathy. And it's actually based, I worked with my friend Linda to do a while back on personality quizzes and I learned disc from her.
But basically the discs, it's funny, I was just talking about this morning in a different interview. So in disc, there's four different personality types. There's dominant, which is the D, I is influencer, S is the steady, and then the C is conscientious. So the D is, I said that dominant, influencer, the steady one is the emotional person. I'm the steady, right? Like give me lots of emotion.
Brittany Herzberg (23:50.839)
Mm-hmm.
Brenna (23:53.316)
I want to hear your long stories, like that sort of thing. The C is conscientious. This is the person who wants to know the facts. They want to know, like, they're the person who wants to know, like, you know, A through Z, what you're offering. So when I think about Pace, I thought about these different personality types. And so the P in Pace, which is personality, which is influencer, how can we show in our content pieces of our personality?
things that are going on in our life. You know, I talk about, I always talk about how I read, you know, cheesy romance books. And I used to, my dear Pug passed away this last summer, but he was a big part of like what I talked about in my content. And so we wanna show people pieces of our personality. And so when I talk about in content is that we want to intertwine peace.
Brittany Herzberg (24:22.06)
Mm-hmm.
Brenna (24:50.568)
So the first thing is the P, which is our personality. The A is our authority. Like, why are you the expert, right? And so authority content can come out in all different types of ways, but it could be the way you talk about your values. Like I talk a lot about how autonomy is very important to me, and that giving people autonomy in their buying decision is super important. And that's why I love pre-launch, because you give people a lot of autonomy, you don't make them feel pressured. So autonomy goes into,
which is the A part, which is also, if I'm thinking through authority, that dominant people wanna see someone who knows their stuff, right? Who they can make quick decisions. So that's the A in PACE. C is credibility, and that is what we've talked about, which is social proof, case studies. How can we actually demonstrate to our people that we are credible, that they should trust us?
Brittany Herzberg (25:31.584)
Yeah.
Brenna (25:45.948)
And then E is empathy and E, that's where the steady comes in. And I feel like empathy is a word that's been way overused and I'm nervous because it's so important, but I feel like it's becoming the word like authentic, right? Like everyone throws around empathy. But really to me, empathy is like, how can we get into the heads of our ideal clients? And this is another reason why market research is so important. Like,
Brittany Herzberg (26:01.479)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Brenna (26:12.5)
how can we show them that we understand where they're at? And that to me is the basis of empathy. So even though I feel like that word's been overplayed a lot in online business, it's that, it's like the knowing of people. I always say like, there's nothing more empathetic in our content that we can do is in to know our customers so well that they feel like we're speaking directly to them. And so, and that is too, once again, it goes back to the, looking at the disc, that is that steady person.
I want the feelings, like I want you to feel the way I feel. And so when we can demonstrate these things, so once again, personality, authority, credibility and empathy, when we can start intertwining these aspects into our content, our people will naturally lean in.
Brittany Herzberg (27:01.51)
Yeah, and that's a really good point because you are hitting on the different personality types and you're giving them each what they really need and what they're looking for. I love that and I feel like case studies are built for the PACE method. I feel like emails can totally be built for the PACE method and even social posts. Knowing that those four things really need to show up now that you know them, it's like, oh, okay, let me just put this out on a checklist and make sure that every time I'm talking about my offer, my program, whatever it is, that I've got that there.
Brenna (27:15.764)
And even those are great. Knowing that those workings are easy to show up, now that you know them, it's like, oh, okay. So we build on the text list and make sure that every time I'm talking about my offer and my program, whatever it is, that I can talk about it. Well, and if you think about it, even in this discussion that we're having as a podcast, like...
Brittany Herzberg (27:31.699)
I love that so much.
Brenna (27:36.932)
we've done face, right? We've talked about personality, things about our personality. There's certain things that we've said that are both strong statements, you know, credibility. I could have intertwined. I'll do it now. You know, where like people that have used pre-launch have seen a triple their enrollment in their programs, right? Like empathy, that I'm really leaning into how people are feeling. You probably do a lot of this even naturally, but you don't realize it. So once again, it goes back to that intention. The more you're aware
Brittany Herzberg (27:38.551)
Mm-hmm.
Brittany Herzberg (27:53.564)
Mm-hmm.
Brenna (28:05.172)
then you can be like, oh, okay, I did talk about this, but I forgot to mention this like social proof of what I have or wait, is there a moment where I can really lean into how this person is feeling at this time so that they can feel like I understand them. And so when you start filtering, so I used to be a social media manager and I talked about all the time, they people talk about buckets of like, one day you have to entertain, one day you have to inspire, one day you have to educate. Like I don't subscribe to that. Like I say, like, let's just get out what,
Brittany Herzberg (28:26.752)
Yeah.
Brenna (28:34.752)
people need to hear and then start thinking about how we can kind of adapt using Pace.
Brittany Herzberg (28:40.146)
Yeah, that's so wise. I really like that. I've never really resonated with the content buckets for whatever reason that just never worked for me. So hearing this is something that to me is much more applicable. And like you said, I'm probably doing it and maybe not even realizing it, or I'm hitting three out of the four and then it's as simple as, oh, I notice I don't have this piece in here. Let me just go back and like add that in a sentence or two. I think that's really smart.
Brenna (28:51.86)
Like you said, I'm probably doing it and maybe not even realizing it or in sitting three out of the four and then it's as simple as, oh, I noticed I don't have the key in here. Let me just.
Exactly. Well.
Brittany Herzberg (29:04.922)
What is your, I've always wanted to ask you this, what is your favorite part of, and I'll give you two options, the pre-launch plan program or just pre-launches in general?
Brenna (29:19.324)
I think what you learn in the pre-launch plan program is just, and it's what I like about pre-launches, is that you just learn to speak in a different way in your content that feels doable and doesn't feel like, a lot of times launches are associated with stress and pressure and cart opening, cart close, where I love like, okay, how can I put out really amazing content?
that gets people leaning in. I just am sending out an email tomorrow. Like it's, the email that I'm writing tomorrow, for tomorrow is talking about how way back in the day I had to cold call, I work for Bank of America, and I used to have to cold call people in the evenings to try and get them to take out home equity loans. And like I never wanted to sell anything ever again, right? I was like 21 calling people, trying to get them to take out huge loans against their houses.
And it's not that of a problem with home equity loans. I think there's a wonderful purpose when you need to, you know, consolidate a lot of credit card debt, when you have, want to do something to your house, you want to build a, I think there's so many purposes, but there's a lot, there's something very different than a customer walking in and saying,
hey, I want to put a pool in my backyard this summer. Can you help me get a loan? And I say, yeah, let's look at our options. You want an equity loan or an equity line versus me calling someone while they're eating dinner. And that's to me the difference between a pre-launch and how launches have been set up. Like launches were, oh my gosh, here's this thing. I'm waving my hands. Where a pre-launch is I'm inviting people into my orbit and getting them to opt in and say, hey, I wanna hear more about this.
Brittany Herzberg (31:07.774)
Yeah, I love that. That visual is definitely going to stick with me to go back to storytelling. I mean, when you do include storytelling and you really make that a part of your marketing and your messaging, it gets those visuals to stick in people's heads. So, okay, well, let's just leave that there because that was perfect. Where can people find you? You mentioned behind the launch, you mentioned pre-launch plan program. Like, where can people find you and learn more about all this stuff?
Brenna (31:20.372)
It gets those visuals to different people. So, okay, so what people got there because that was purple. Where can people find you? You mentioned the hangar lines, you mentioned the school office, you mentioned the program. Like, where can people find you and then you're on it? Yes, so brendamagowan.co.
and there you can find information behind the launch won't be happening again until August so there won't be information about that just yet but that's where you can get onto my email list. I have a pre-launch cheat sheet where you can go ahead and figure out this type of content that we've been talking about like what type of content do my people need to see before I launch so you can grab the cheat sheet that gives you different ideas. There's also if you're interested the pre-launch plan program we're officially
officially opening our doors in March and you're listening to me and like, yes, I need this system. Like I need a way to talk about my stuff and I want to do it in a way that doesn't feel, feel like a ton of pressure, a lot of sales. And it's really, someone said, um, that it's, it's working like smarter and not harder. And that's really what I want. Right. Like how can we create this like smarter, less hectic launch time?
So if that's something that you're interested in, I would love to talk to you about that as well.
Brittany Herzberg (32:34.738)
Yeah, it really isn't. Like you said earlier, it really feels so doable. And this is my first launch that I'm actually going to be rolling into pretty soon where I have had the pre-launch actually ready to go all set up. I followed the plan. I'm so excited. So stay tuned. I'll share more on that, but I'll make sure I've got the links behind the launch, just a plug for that as well. I'm so excited for that. Every time you do this, this is like one of my favorite summits to listen to because you get to hear from some really...
big name people who have done launches and you learn lessons from them and you get to think through different angles of things that you could include in your launch that you maybe never thought of. I just love those conversations. So never feared, that link down below is going to be accurate at all times because every time Brenna launches the behind the launch, I'm always like, let me make sure that's the accurate link.
Brenna (33:25.528)
Yes, yes. So you can look at the link, it won't have a place to sign up. And so for everyone who's listening to Behind the Launch is a conversation series. So
I ask guest experts one question, which is what worked well during your last launch and the answers, everything we do, these are quick conversations I've had with them on Voxer. And so I just like package up those conversations and you get to eavesdrop on the conversations that I have with all of these amazing people who are doing big things. And then too, you could also come find me in the Behind the Launch Facebook group because we have past interviews. Every time I do a Behind the Launch.
I always interview guest experts that want to come in and I say, okay, what's something that didn't work so well? And it's amazing the things that people have done that haven't worked well, we learned just as much from and all of those conversations are still in the Facebook group.
Brittany Herzberg (34:19.414)
Yeah, I'm glad you shared that. We'll make sure that is linked below. And anyone who's ever connected with me on Voxer, you can thank Brenda because she's the reason that I'm on Voxer and that I now use it for everything. I haven't even really done sales calls on Zoom since I've been on Voxer. I just have conversations with people and it's going back to that natural word, it just feels so much easier and so much less pressure and people can just ask questions and then it's like, okay, cool, I'm in. So thank you.
Brenna (34:23.272)
Anyone who's ever connected with me on WhatsApp you can go to one of those meetings because I'm on WhatsApp. And then I announce you that for everything. I haven't even really done sales calls and I'm doing some things on WhatsApp. I've just had a conversation with people and it's going back to that natural world. It's just so much easier and you can look on WhatsApp and people can do past questions and then you're like, okay, cool, I'm in. Yeah, well, even as a person who does sales calls, it's like, I can actually like.
take a moment and think, not feel like this, like, oh, I gotta have all the answers, right? Yeah, the Voxer is an amazing tool.
Brittany Herzberg (34:55.622)
Such an amazing tool. So thank you for Voxer. Thank you for PPP. Thank you for being here. And I really appreciate this conversation because this is something that I wanted to share with the world about. So thank you so much.
Brenna (34:57.704)
Thank you for Voxer, thank you for PDT, thank you for being here, and I really appreciate this conversation because this is something that I wanted to picture with a little of that, so thank you so much. Thank you, I appreciate it. All right, I will touch you.
Brittany Herzberg (35:09.514)
Yeah. All right. I will catch you next time.